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Corpse
Don't Dream It, Be It
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:45 pm Posts: 37162 Location: The Graveyard
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Krem wrote: Apostle Ericka wrote: That can lead to some serious problems though. How do we know a mod/admin are wearing their hat or not when they make certain posts? They don't need anyone to back them up. You guys can very easily say you didn't have your hat on that night, or for that minute. How do we know this stuff? That's the main problem here I think. Users don't know enough of how things work. The rules don't include this stuff. They touch on how everyone can be offended in different ways, and no one can say if that reason is valid or not, etc. But that's it. Shouldn't the posters know this? And shouldn't the mods/admins be the ones to keep such things to a minimum instead of joining in on matters where they can take off their hats? That's certainly not what I meant when I brought up the point about wearing two hats. The point is that mods are expected to be like any other poster; however they are also expected not to bring personal feelings when it comes to their mod duties. You just nailed the bud that has spawned all of this bickering.
_________________Japan Box Office “Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.” “We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.” “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” “You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.” "Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."
Last edited by Corpse on Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:40 am |
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Chippy
KJ's Leading Pundit
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:45 pm Posts: 63026 Location: Tonight... YOU!
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Eagle wrote: Munk·E wrote: To get respect you should earn it. I couldn't disagree more. I always try and show others respect, even when they least deserve it. I stumble sometimes, but I always try. Yes, but do people DESERVE the respect you're giving? Not usually.
_________________trixster wrote: shut the fuck up zwackerm, you're out of your fucking element trixster wrote: chippy is correct
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:40 am |
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Maverikk
Award Winning Bastard
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:03 am Posts: 15310 Location: Slumming at KJ
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Mr. X wrote: To elaborate on two issues:
-I don't think mods should be allowed to ignore users. I also think the admins' take on this should be open to discussion. Mods should view every post and thread that they can. No, I know they're not God and can't read every thread and post in the entire forum, but they also shouldn't be able to pick and choose which posts/threads they read when they ignore a user.
-I don't think mods or admins should be able to play mod/admin some of the time and normal user other times. I understand issues arise. But if you can't handle them like a mod or an admin, you shouldn't be a mod or an admin. At the very least, this should apply to mods. When do you consider it a double standard?
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:41 am |
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Chippy
KJ's Leading Pundit
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:45 pm Posts: 63026 Location: Tonight... YOU!
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
This whole issue is:
Corpse made a thread that was a direct link to a thread that got out of hand because of what the thread was about. This new thread was essentially WHY the last thread got closed. Thus, it was closed. It was 100% warranted.
No other thread I've seen lately was a deliberate attempt to cause drama more so than that.
_________________trixster wrote: shut the fuck up zwackerm, you're out of your fucking element trixster wrote: chippy is correct
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:43 am |
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batnanna
Da Bears
Joined: Thu May 04, 2006 2:15 am Posts: 2802 Location: Springfield, Missouri
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
That comment of jujubees that Mr. X brought up really isn't that bad. At least I don't see it that way. Perhaps she was asking if she read what she just wrote because some of it didn't seem to make sense. I mean I sometimes get lost in the run on sentences and forget what the point of what Corpse was trying to say sometimes. About the whole mods only being mods sometimes, that is how it should be. No one should have to just be a mod all the time and be expected to never make any sarcastic remarks or have no fun. People are made mods primarily to do the simple tasks that admins don't always have time for. Sometimes they have to step in when things get out of hand between posters because it is their job to keep he forum as healthy as possible. I don't think jujubee ever acted out of spite or anything like that. If I were a mod and someone posted a thread that I thought would cause more trouble, I'd probably lock it. Maybe the thread would have turned out fine (I doubt it), but you can't really blame someone for doing what they think is right.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:45 am |
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Mister Ecks
New Server, Same X
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:07 pm Posts: 28301 Location: ... siiiigh...
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Eagle wrote: Korrgan, asking mods and admins to show eveyrone respect 100% of the time is a simple impossibility. Mods are not Jesus, and some people make it very hard to show them respect.
In the mod forum, there is a mod faq which does ask that mods attempt to show respect, even to those who don't deserve it. It's a general principle that should be applied.
That said, nothing jujubee said to you was out of line. Nothing she said to you would have earned her a warning if she was a regular user. Nothing she said to you was as awful as you are making it out to be. I would love if in the future she showed everyone respect, including you.
I don't want mods who are heavy handed, think they are better than regular posters, or anything similar. I don't believe that describes jujubee at all or she would not be a mod. Show her respect, which you have not done in the slightest, and maybe she will show you some in return. Eagle, I know you guys aren't perfect. But, there seemed to be a flame war going on in the thread with Corpse (directed at Corpse), and jujubee joined in with the comment I've mentioned, insulting Corpse. It just goes back to my point that this isn't something a mod should do. There are times when things get out of hand, but jujubee never had to make that kind of comment.
_________________ Ecks Factor: Cancelled too soon
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:46 am |
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Corpse
Don't Dream It, Be It
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:45 pm Posts: 37162 Location: The Graveyard
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Munk·E wrote: This whole issue is:
Corpse made a thread that was a direct link to a thread that got out of hand because of what the thread was about. This new thread was essentially WHY the last thread got closed. Thus, it was closed. It was 100% warranted.
No other thread I've seen lately was a deliberate attempt to cause drama more so than that. That thread was the complete opposite of what you just said. There was obviously tension and drama about, and I didn't like how some users were bringing Eagle into as much as they did, and I wanted to tell everybody to reconsider their post-argument opinion of Eagle if they had one. And apparently several did from the post-argument posts I read. And it bothered me a little bit because even in the middle of that argument with him and bABA I attempted to keep myself under control to cause as little hate or damage as possible since it took so long to get locked..
_________________Japan Box Office “Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.” “We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.” “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” “You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.” "Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."
Last edited by Corpse on Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:46 am |
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Eagle
Site Owner
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 1:09 pm Posts: 14631 Location: Pittsburgh
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Batmanda wrote: That comment of jujubees that Mr. X brought up really isn't that bad. At least I don't see it that way. Perhaps she was asking if she read what she just wrote because some of it didn't seem to make sense. I mean I sometimes get lost in the run on sentences and forget what the point of what Corpse was trying to say sometimes. About the whole mods only being mods sometimes, that is how it should be. No one should have to just be a mod all the time and be expected to never make any sarcastic remarks or have no fun. People are made mods primarily to do the simple tasks that admins don't always have time for. Sometimes they have to step in when things get out of hand between posters because it is their job to keep he forum as healthy as possible. I don't think jujubee ever acted out of spite or anything like that. If I were a mod and someone posted a thread that I thought would cause more trouble, I'd probably lock it. Maybe the thread would have turned out fine (I doubt it), but you can't really blame someone for doing what they think is right. You operate a board, so I think you understand where we are all coming from. As for jujubee's comments, I can understand what Korrgan is saying about the comments, but I agree, there was nothing that out of line about them. I think jujubee may have let frustration color her post, and I can totally understand. In my opinion, she did nothing wrong, she's human just like the rest of us.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:48 am |
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Mister Ecks
New Server, Same X
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:07 pm Posts: 28301 Location: ... siiiigh...
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Batmanda wrote: That comment of jujubees that Mr. X brought up really isn't that bad. At least I don't see it that way. Perhaps she was asking if she read what she just wrote because some of it didn't seem to make sense. Maybe that wasn't clear (I don't always provide all the details, and often don't make sense myself, sorry). The " " smiley at the end of her post was the real insult. It showed what she thought of Corpse's opinion on the matter, and that's not how a mod should react. If a mod gets pissed off, fine. I will briefly accept that, even though I still don't think mods should act as anything but mods. But doesn't help anyone.
_________________ Ecks Factor: Cancelled too soon
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:49 am |
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Eagle
Site Owner
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 1:09 pm Posts: 14631 Location: Pittsburgh
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Mr. X wrote: Eagle wrote: Korrgan, asking mods and admins to show eveyrone respect 100% of the time is a simple impossibility. Mods are not Jesus, and some people make it very hard to show them respect.
In the mod forum, there is a mod faq which does ask that mods attempt to show respect, even to those who don't deserve it. It's a general principle that should be applied.
That said, nothing jujubee said to you was out of line. Nothing she said to you would have earned her a warning if she was a regular user. Nothing she said to you was as awful as you are making it out to be. I would love if in the future she showed everyone respect, including you.
I don't want mods who are heavy handed, think they are better than regular posters, or anything similar. I don't believe that describes jujubee at all or she would not be a mod. Show her respect, which you have not done in the slightest, and maybe she will show you some in return. Eagle, I know you guys aren't perfect. But, there seemed to be a flame war going on in the thread with Corpse (directed at Corpse), and jujubee joined in with the comment I've mentioned, insulting Corpse. It just goes back to my point that this isn't something a mod should do. There are times when things get out of hand, but jujubee never had to make that kind of comment.We're human Mr. X. We say things maybe we shouldn't have, or said with more respect. I think this is one of those cases. Jujubee could have shown more respect in this situation, but that said, nothing she said was as awful or disrespectful as you are making it out to be. I had a post written, that I deleted, which was far, far worse.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:51 am |
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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
I think this thread has pretty much run its course. Unless someone comes up with a NEW complaint against mods, I will lock it in 10 minutes. It's time to go to bed, people!
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:51 am |
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batnanna
Da Bears
Joined: Thu May 04, 2006 2:15 am Posts: 2802 Location: Springfield, Missouri
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Eagle wrote: You operate a board, so I think you understand where we are all coming from.
As for jujubee's comments, I can understand what Korrgan is saying about the comments, but I agree, there was nothing that out of line about them. I think jujubee may have let frustration color her post, and I can totally understand. In my opinion, she did nothing wrong, she's human just like the rest of us.
Well yeah, I can see how Corpse and Korrgan or anyone could have taken that comment, regardless of how it was meant. But I don't really see it as something so bad that it should be causing this much of an uproar. It's not like she's said somethng like "holy hell, you're a dumb bitch, how did you ever make it through school!?" People are going to get into little scuffles and make little comments like that all the time. No big deal if you don't make it out that way and let little things like that get to you.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:55 am |
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Corpse
Don't Dream It, Be It
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:45 pm Posts: 37162 Location: The Graveyard
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
This was my complaints to begin with. But I don't mind anyone else posting theres in here tonight or whatever.
And whether or not anyone wants to believe it, I care very much about the posters here, including bABA, jujubee, etc. If I think a poster or posters are in an avoidable argument, I'll attempt to calm it down. Just like what I did recently behind the scenes with bABA and Ladiesman217. That one ended fairly well I think. I'll go out of my way to settle disputes without anyone even knowing I did anything to begin with. It's because I like the forum to be a healthy place, the less fighting, name calling, teasing, the better.
_________________Japan Box Office “Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.” “We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.” “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” “You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.” "Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:57 am |
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Eagle
Site Owner
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 1:09 pm Posts: 14631 Location: Pittsburgh
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Batmanda wrote: Eagle wrote: You operate a board, so I think you understand where we are all coming from.
As for jujubee's comments, I can understand what Korrgan is saying about the comments, but I agree, there was nothing that out of line about them. I think jujubee may have let frustration color her post, and I can totally understand. In my opinion, she did nothing wrong, she's human just like the rest of us.
Well yeah, I can see how Corpse and Korrgan or anyone could have taken that comment, regardless of how it was meant. But I don't really see it as something so bad that it should be causing this much of an uproar. It's not like she's said somethng like "holy hell, you're a dumb bitch, how did you ever make it through school!?" People are going to get into little scuffles and make little comments like that all the time. No big deal if you don't make it out that way and let little things like that get to you. I don't think it's all related to that comment. I think it points to a frustration between the users involved and in this thread which has been building for a little bit now. We just need to take the kettle off the stove and let that steam blow out peacefully. Both sides need to regress toward the middle.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:58 am |
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batnanna
Da Bears
Joined: Thu May 04, 2006 2:15 am Posts: 2802 Location: Springfield, Missouri
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Apostle Ericka wrote: I'll go out of my way to settle disputes without anyone even knowing I did anything to begin with. .[/b][/color] At first I didn't see the word anyone in there and thought you said you go out of your way without even knowing you did anything, which makes no sense whatsoever. I was about to quote you and say "did you even read what you just wrote?" 
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:59 am |
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Maverikk
Award Winning Bastard
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:03 am Posts: 15310 Location: Slumming at KJ
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
I wish you all would resolve what looks to be silliness that you'll look back on and laugh about.
I also hope that jujubee will give me a chance a little more.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:01 am |
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Corpse
Don't Dream It, Be It
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:45 pm Posts: 37162 Location: The Graveyard
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Batmanda wrote: Apostle Ericka wrote: I'll go out of my way to settle disputes without anyone even knowing I did anything to begin with. .[/b][/color] At first I didn't see the word anyone in there and thought you said you go out of your way without even knowing you did anything, which makes no sense whatsoever. I was about to quote you and say "did you even read what you just wrote?"  To be honest, when I try this sometimes, things fall into place and it works out and I don't know how it happened exactly, so that almost fits to.
_________________Japan Box Office “Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.” “We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.” “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” “You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.” "Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:02 am |
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kypade
Kypade
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 7908
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:35 am |
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Shack
Devil's Advocate
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 2:30 am Posts: 40611
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Honestly, I don't get the complaints against jujubee? Is the "I'm psychic" line really reason for huge complaint? Not locking a thread because it was the middle of the night? For the record, I support Corpse's thread in the Water Cooler being locked. It was a continuation of a mess that had already gone on for like 13 pages, the issue had run its course, there was no need for more flame wars and drama. What on earth are you guys bickering about?
From what I've seen, she's been absolutely mature and respectful in her modding work... It definitley seems like the attacks are coming from one side.
_________________Shack’s top 50 tv shows - viewtopic.php?f=8&t=90227
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:39 pm |
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Shack
Devil's Advocate
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 2:30 am Posts: 40611
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Lord Maverikk wrote: I wish you all would resolve what looks to be silliness that you'll look back on and laugh about. Absolutely The issues in here are as small as peas
_________________Shack’s top 50 tv shows - viewtopic.php?f=8&t=90227
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:42 pm |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
I will take the time and read this thread in its entirety at a later point, but I've gotta say that I have had my share of issues with a couple of WOKJ mods (nothing too serious, though), but as far as the current staff goes... haven't had a single problem with them and haven't really witnessed anything bad either. All going well.
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:42 pm |
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Ripper
2.71828183
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:16 pm Posts: 7827 Location: please delete me
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Korrgan wrote: That's not what happened. Pretty much everyone involved was saying crap about Corpse, and in rode jujubee, saying even more, when she had no reason to be frustrated. A mod/admin should try to calm the masses and end any fights, not join the masses with more cattle calls.
Look, I know not a thing is gonna come of arguing, so I'm just gonna stop now. I've said what I've wanted.
Everyone was saying crap about Corpse because she asked people too, she asked a question, she got an answer, including from jujubee. You and Mr.X make it seem out of nowhere COrpse was being attacked, and the big bad villian jujubee came outta nowhere to egg the mob on. You can not like a person and still do your job. They can even know you don't like them and you can still do your job. Had a mod/admin locked corpse's original thread eariler, someone would be bitching about that too.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:35 pm |
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Korrgan
problem?
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:52 am Posts: 15515 Location: Bait Shop
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Ripper wrote: Korrgan wrote: That's not what happened. Pretty much everyone involved was saying crap about Corpse, and in rode jujubee, saying even more, when she had no reason to be frustrated. A mod/admin should try to calm the masses and end any fights, not join the masses with more cattle calls.
Look, I know not a thing is gonna come of arguing, so I'm just gonna stop now. I've said what I've wanted.
Everyone was saying crap about Corpse because she asked people too, she asked a question, she got an answer, including from jujubee. You and Mr.X make it seem out of nowhere COrpse was being attacked, and the big bad villian jujubee came outta nowhere to egg the mob on. You can not like a person and still do your job. They can even know you don't like them and you can still do your job. Had a mod/admin locked corpse's original thread eariler, someone would be bitching about that too. I know everyone was already attacking her, I just don't think it's good protocol for a mod to join in a flame war when there's already enough people baiting the flames.I don't honestly have a problem with juju's mod work, the little I've seen she's done her job correctly. My issue is not with her mod skills.
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:52 pm |
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Shack
Devil's Advocate
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 2:30 am Posts: 40611
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Again, it's not like jujubee was calling her a worthless dirty attention-seeking whore. She was participating in the discussion Corpse was asking for, just like everyone else, it's not like the two got into a one on one insult war or anything.
_________________Shack’s top 50 tv shows - viewtopic.php?f=8&t=90227
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:54 pm |
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Corpse
Don't Dream It, Be It
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:45 pm Posts: 37162 Location: The Graveyard
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 Re: My Mod/Admin Complaints
Shack wrote: Again, it's not like jujubee was calling her a worthless dirty attention-seeking whore. She was participating in the discussion Corpse was asking for, just like everyone else, it's not like the two got into a one on one insult war or anything. No. That thread was a normal "what I think of you, and what you think of me" type thread that got derailed once I began asking why certain posters thought a certain way. Which was one of the options one of the admins themselves said I should do with the answers I get later on in the thread. As soon as I began asking for more details from certain posters, the "You are an attention whore" posts began. And that developed into the arguments that included Eagle and bABA. It's like they were against me deciding to ask for more detail from some posters/posts, yet one of them later said it was a an option I could take with the responses I receieved, which I did before anyone even suggested doing that.
And for the record, I didn't mind jujubee's comment either way because I could care less about it. The main issue I have with the mods/admins is what Krem brought up about how mods/admins should never let personal feelings affect how they handle situations (this includes coming to a poster personally like, a friends, aid too obviously), which almost never happens. I think that is the source of anyone else who has complained in this thread too.
_________________Japan Box Office “Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.” “We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.” “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.” “You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.” "Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."
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Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:34 pm |
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