Ya, thought I'd credit you at the end with the rest of the people who don't think I'm capable of thinking for myself.

Anyways...

Nice to see some critical feedback. Once again affirming that everyone here actually has a brain, agrees and disagrees as they deem fit, and that no one gives a movie a grade based on other people's sentiment. So we can all stop with the he said she said only because you said bit.

I happen to really respect what was written in this thread as far as disagreement, which has been miles better than...

*random tween fan blonde celebrity* was so cute, A+++! I liked when that building blew up, A+++++++++!

Let me know what you guys thought about Walk on Water too!

And ya know what? I am the winner in the end, since I actually did get all the people here to see it. And I can still go here to see my opinion re-affirmed: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0363163/

Heh, yup. That's what it's all about, right?

I voted it an 8 at imdb, btw.

Z, this is why I enjoy our conversations so much.

Yes, what you said is true and I am honored that you have continued to use the wording that I bestowed on you.

**************

That said, re-read mine as what I said is still correct > All I said was you refer yourself to it and it was in one of his sign-offs.

**************

Well, an 8 is better than a B-, so you did like it. To semi-quote you:

"inside you're just a boy, standing in front of a computer, trying to tell us you love Downfall"

Downfall is one of those instances where you rate a movie on a higher, more demanding scale. When I give Corpse Bride a B- and Downfall a B-, I don't really consider them to be the same caliber of film. Downfall is much more demanding of the viewer and itself sets high levels for success. When I give it a B-, it's being compared against the best of the best- and it's by no means a bad grade. (whereas CB against other animated movies - completely different situations) I would recommend it as an above average movie. I just wasn't particularly enthused; I still enjoyed the insight into the last days of the Hitler regime.

Twas good stuff, just not exceptional stuff...

Well, at least you gotta admit Ganz delivered a stand-out performance

Oh, yes. I'm torn between giving the KJ vote to Ganz and Ledger. He was, as I mentioned, the reason why Downfall got a B- instead of something noticeably lower.

*cough cough cough Ganz cough cough*

It will probably make you happy that I actually found a way to go to a special screening of Brokeback Mountain the night just before the Oscars and before the KJ awards

(Ganz!)

That's great, but I hardly expect you to change your vote. Heh. I bet so much you'll give BBM a B-.... Interesting, no? Heh, you'll find the performances above average, but the story overrated. I know it.

Sound familiar, sort of?

Sort of.

I might change my vote, but that is rather unlikely as I think Ganz delivers one of the best performances I have seen in years and it is unlikely to see two of this kind in one year.

Then again,. I will also see Capote soon too.

Eh, I give Ganz credit even moreso than I gave Hopkins for Silence of the Lambs. All actors will tell you they need to get into the psychology of the role, and also bring themselves into it. How do you get into the psychology of Hitler? "Ok, well let me just think what he must have been thinking right now...really think and feel it."

Its a daunting tastk to say the least and probably one of the reasons no actor has ever tried to pick up a role like this. Everyone else, the stuggling writer, the activist news broadcaster, the repressed longing and emotional stagnation, these are all characters that are easier for me to comprehend taking on.

There's a big barrier history has set up that is almost insurmountable when an actor tries to assume this role. I give him complete credit for immersing himself in character and bringing his decades of veteran acting into the role. It's the backbone of the entire film. Rough stuff, and while I appreciate it immensly, if I was an actor, I probably would have passed that role up. That's why he really deserves such homage.

My thoughts exactly.

Ganz for Best Actor!

I rarely rent movies. This weekend I rented two, this and The Eye.

The movie is very good. Not in the same class as SPR and Schindler's list. But very few movies are on that level. On par with The Painist. Well worth watching.

A-

Have you been too impressed by Ganz' tremendous performance?

I would say so. His performance was excellent.

They were showing Downfall on Starz....i watched like 2 minutes and it looks good, hopefully theyll show it tomorrow because i dont have Starz and its only a preview of the channel

....

I cant believe how good this movie was. Bruno Ganz must be Hitler reincarnated, because he was flawless. Haunting movie.

More need to see this masterpiece!

Copied over from the Foreign and Independent forum

I'm going to come straight out and say this is the type of film that should be mandatory viewing in History classrooms. For every other facate of World War 2 be it Russian Front brutality (Come and See) the changes the journey of war has on the pychice (The Big Red One: The Reconstruction) all the way to the horrors of the Holocaust (Schindlers List) their stories are covered superbly and vividly, their tales a fitting companion to the written history we can all absorb.

But it wasn't until Downfall that the story of the end of the nightmarish dream that was the Third Reich was given a suitable visual backup to the written accounts that abound from the last days of Berlin. And more importently It does what no other movie until then had the balls to do, and that is give a truly accurate portrayal of Hitler not as a pantomine monster but as a real flesh and blood human being, something which makes his actions infinatly more sinister and evil.

Watching this movie is almost like observing a person suffering the withdrawal symptoms of an hellucinagenic drug. The Russians are closing in the end beckons and yet the crazy air of "we can still win" hangs in the mind of Hitler and his Leuteneints. He commands imaginery Armies, plans for future campaigns that will never come to pass, it acts as the answer to the question of why Hitler brought it all the way to the brutal end, why for him a repeat of the capitulation of 1918 was never an option. This answer could always be found in the textbooks but it truly is heartening to see it represented on film simply because the in todays age its a fact that its more likely to be see by more this way. The scenes which deal with his military fantasy are among the most mesmerising. We see the bellowing crazed Hitler the man seen in those black and white newsreels of the day, but its the change in character in these scenes that makes them such interesting viewing. The change in attitude from a calm almost docile Fuhrer to what at some points seems like a raving maniac. A pantomine monster can be fobbed off as an abboration from History. But this reminds us that Hitler was human and there is no gaurantee another of his ilk will not rise angain.

Bruno Ganz truly cannot be praised enough for his performance. Everything from the tone of voice, the hunched stance to the quivering arm is scarely accurate. He becomes Hitler right in front of you, its sometimes hard to believe its a actor playing a role its that convincing.

Its a movie that also examines the role of the German people themselves brilliantly. The various characters from Alexandra Maria Lara's Traudl Junge to Christian Berkels Dr. Ernst-Günter Schenck all the way to Ulrich Matthes Joseph Goebbels all act in a way as cyphers of the various states of mind the German people must have felt in 1945. Junge is the naive youth that has been lead to the slaughter by a man that has dominated their lifes and even at the end they refuse to beleive the truth of Hitlers evil, fighting on for a cause long lost, Schenck stands as the older wiser head, the German who's wisdom of the past leave him cold and realising of reality, the Germans that in a way resisted the Nazi's but got dragged along in the euphoric insanity of it all unable to stop. And Goebbels stands as the Germans of 1945 who in the end were beyond redemption, there belief in the cause absolute their humanity long since stripped away. For them this truly is the end of a macabre dream.

Downfall is the endgame of Hitler writ large on screen, but its even more then that. Its the violence and self destructive suicide of Europe reaching its sad inevitable conclusion. The end of the premacy of Europe the colonial empires, the rise of the USA and the Soviet Union, they all ended/began here. Its fitting that such an event gets such an amazing mesmeric film.

A+

Gulli, did you just sit down tonight(or this morning? for you) and think to yourself

"I'm going to bump and review a whole bunch of random films that I've seen"

Not really, just decided to go thru the review archive and the writing juices were flowing so off i went.

At least i'm not just giving 1 line reviews