Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:13 pm Posts: 15197 Location: Planet Xatar
Re: The 3D thread
D-Box - - I wrote about seeing Inception in D-Box format here on KJ - - in a nutshell, my opinion was: "almost as unnecessary a gimmick as 3D".
Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:52 am
Nazgul9
Extraordinary
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 12:32 pm Posts: 11289 Location: Germany
Re: The 3D thread
On the topic of film vs digital:
Quote:
So we were invited to see some Spiderman footage today at Sony. John Schwartzman [cinematographer] was there and we talked a bit before going into the screening room.
"This is the best looking footage I have ever shot... these are the best images I have ever seen!" was his comment. I asked him if this was just his enthusiasm spilling out or if this was actually the case (pretty big statement). He thought for a few moments and said "No, really... this is the best footage I have ever seen from any camera. Ever."
So, with that, we went in. There was a Sony T420 projector (same as we have at RED Studios) in a grading room at Colorworks. We talked to "The Steve" (colorist) about his experience with the EPIC footage and opinion. He confirmed his opinion matched John's and we sat front row with huge expectations.
I have to say that we were all stunned. Shocked. So incredible. Not like RED ONE MX. Not like anything we had seen from another camera. Same resolution and feel of our new EPIC reel, but with actors and a story and Schwartzman's ability to light.
The consensus in the room (to a person) was that this looked like film. Like 65mm film. Better. Without any trace of film's blocky detail in shadows or grain. Jaw dropping.
EPIC is performing as it's name implies it should. We will keep John's comment close to us... to remind us how hard we need to work to never lose this position. We really like it.
Featuring commentary and opinion on the wreckage along the roadside of the history of failed movie gimmicks, including D-Box, 3D, Sensurround, and Smell-o-Vision - - well worth reading as always!
This is a chart I have made chronicling the ratio of the % of 3D OW Gross to % of 3D OW Theaters over time.
It's remarkable that we see such a clear trend despite the varying % of 3D we expect to see among films of different genres.
Culminating in Pirates and Panda, it's clear that it's high time for films to either up the ante in 3D quality or don't do it at all. Falling below a ratio of 1 on this chart means that the 3D gross % is less that the 3D theaters %, although from this we don't know about actual 3D vs non screen counts. I don't know the breakdowns at that level, so I can't really conclude which format is more popular since a film may or may not be playing in both 2d and 3d at the same theater, but it's clearly getting close to 2D being preferred if it's not there yet.
Uping the quality of 3D will have marginal effects on the percent 3D. True market saturation of 3D will only happen once ticket prices are reduced down to the price of regular admission. We've reached the point where consumers have found that the benefit of 3D does not outweigh the extra cost of admission anymore. Hopefully the executives aren't too shortsighted and decide to slash prices.
These guys are going to be pivotal in undoing the damage done to 3D.
I think over the long haul 3D quality will go up and the format will stay, the surcharge will stabilize at or below today's level, and the percent of people who choose it will stabilize at a higher level than it is today, probably closer to Avatar's level than where it is now.
Avatar 2 will probably finally prove the point (about quality), backed by these other filmmakers, and then Hollywood at large will probably finally get it. If all goes well, Avatar 2 could even permanently elevate 3D's status beyond its post-Avatar status.
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:13 pm Posts: 15197 Location: Planet Xatar
Re: The 3D thread
Proud Ryu wrote:
This is a chart I have made chronicling the ratio of the % of 3D OW Gross to % of 3D OW Theaters over time.
It's remarkable that we see such a clear trend despite the varying % of 3D we expect to see among films of different genres.
Culminating in Pirates and Panda, it's clear that it's high time for films to either up the ante in 3D quality or don't do it at all. Falling below a ratio of 1 on this chart means that the 3D gross % is less that the 3D theaters %, although from this we don't know about actual 3D vs non screen counts. I don't know the breakdowns at that level, so I can't really conclude which format is more popular since a film may or may not be playing in both 2d and 3d at the same theater, but it's clearly getting close to 2D being preferred if it's not there yet.
Proud Ryu wrote:
Green Lantern set a new low for % gross in 3D as a % of % theaters in 3D.
The previous low was KFP2, and PTOC4 before that - i.e. the last 3 3D films set new successive lows.
I really enjoyed your analysis and chart of the declining fortunes of 3D. I hope you can find the time to add Green Lantern and future releases as time goes by.
Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:56 pm
Rev
Romosexual!
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 3:06 am Posts: 32603 Location: the last free city
My first hint at the 3D scam was in October 2009 when Toy Story and Toy Story 2 were re-released in the theaters as 3D movies. My kids were excited to see Toy Story on the big screen for the first time so we gladly ponied up the extra money to see the 3D version of the double feature. We weren’t very far into the first movie before I realized that the quality of the colors and images were actually worse in 3D. That was a big disappointment. Even my kids said that the 3D wasn’t as exciting as they thought it would be. There went an extra $24 down the drain ($3 extra for 3D for four people for two movies).
Of course, the Toy Story movies were standard 2D movies that were converted to 3D (which is actually the way most “3D” movies are still handled). So, what about movies that are natively shot with special 3D cameras, such as Avatar? I’ll admit that when I first saw Avatar in the theaters I was impressed at how well it wove in the 3D effects. But, my admiration wore off once I saw it on Blu-ray on a 240Hz LED TV and quickly realized that all of the colors and action shots suddenly came to life and really popped off the screen. That’s when it fully dawned on me what a horrible scam 3D really is. They are making us pay more money for a gimmicky, inferior experience. Sure, there are a few neat moments in most 3D movies, but the novelty wears very off quickly and it’s certainly not worth the trade-off in picture quality or action sequences.
I had started to see this coming a little sooner, and I should have pounced on it. Back at the 2009 Consumer Electronics Show, I was dazzled by the new LED TVs that Samsung showed off at its big press conference. The images were so sharp and the colors were so bright that the picture almost felt three dimensional. Plus the TV themselves were amazingly thin.
The next year, at CES 2010, I was surprised to see all of the TV manufacturers including Samsung pushing TVs with 3D glasses. I immediately felt like this was a step backward. I didn’t want to mess around with watching TV with 3D glasses. I wanted to see more super thin TVs with amazing pictures (at even better prices) like the ones I had seen the year before. After consumers rejected 3D TVs in 2010, the companies tried to come back at CES 2011 and pitch “no glasses” 3D. I wanted to shake my head and do a face-palm every time one of these electronics vendors mentioned 3D.
This is a bad detour for the entertainment and electronics industries, and they stubbornly refuse to let it die. In fact, they keep trying to push 3D on us, since many of these new products have been in planning for a year or two (before consumers started catching on to the 3D scam). The movie industry and movie theaters try to force us to only be able to watch some of their top movies in 3D (and pay extra for it). TV makers are forcing 3D into all of their new top-of-the-line LED TVs (and trying to make us to pay extra for it). Content companies are now making their Blu-ray/DVD/Digital Copy bundles include 3D discs (and trying to make us pay extra for it). Game companies such as Nintendo are integrating gimmicky 3D into their new systems. Mobile computing vendors such as HTC and LG are even trying to put 3D into their smartphones and tablets.
There’s only one way to stop the madness. Avoid 3D whenever possible.
This is a bad experiment that the industry is forcing consumers to subsidize. And since they can’t create a better product, they’ve simply latched on to 3D as a marketing ploy that the entertainment and electronics industries can use to trick people into thinking that they are getting a superior experience. It’s only working because just enough people are falling for the scam to keep it alive.
A lot of smart people have already sniffed this out and are avoiding 3D entertainment. It’s time for the rest of the public to reject 3D and stop being cheated.
It’s not that we don’t want innovation in real life imaging. Of course, we do. We just want real innovation, and don’t want to pay for badly-overpriced gimmicks and half-baked experiments.
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Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:00 pm
Nazgul9
Extraordinary
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 12:32 pm Posts: 11289 Location: Germany
Re: The 3D thread
Is this written by Bradley?
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Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:36 pm
Nazgul9
Extraordinary
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 12:32 pm Posts: 11289 Location: Germany
Re: The 3D thread
That's why i asked if it's Bradley.
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Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:28 pm
Bradley Witherberry
Extraordinary
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:13 pm Posts: 15197 Location: Planet Xatar
Re: The 3D thread
Nazgul9 wrote:
Is this written by Bradley?
trixster sucks wrote:
Impossible. Bradley is incapable of having a accurate assessment of things.
Nazgul9 wrote:
That's why i asked if it's Bradley.
I didn't write it, but I am glad to hear you agree that the article posted by Rev is an accurate assessment.
I think TF3 will likley stay around 55-60% 3D like Thor.
If that happens, the numbers will be quite boosted for it.
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Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:26 pm
Bradley Witherberry
Extraordinary
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:13 pm Posts: 15197 Location: Planet Xatar
Re: The 3D thread
Mannyisthebest wrote:
I think TF3 will likley stay around 55-60% 3D like Thor.
If that happens, the numbers will be quite boosted for it.
Could there still be that many suckers by July 2011?!?
This fad's fading fast - - snap a picture - - it's gonna be gone before you know it...
Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:29 am
David
Pure Phase
Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:33 am Posts: 34865 Location: Maryland
Re: The 3D thread
3-D needs to die, definitely.
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Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:31 am
Speevy
Veteran
Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 9:12 am Posts: 3139
Re: The 3D thread
3D won't die, there's just far too much riding on it. Movies, TV, video games, phones, etc. I do expect a major price decrease for 3D movie tickets within the coming year though.
Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:52 am
Bradley Witherberry
Extraordinary
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:13 pm Posts: 15197 Location: Planet Xatar
Re: The 3D thread
Speevy wrote:
3D won't die, there's just far too much riding on it. Movies, TV, video games, phones, etc. I do expect a major price decrease for 3D movie tickets within the coming year though.
If I was used to going to the concession stand and getting an old school popcorn with butter topping, then one day the theatre management decided to offer popcorn with shit topping at a premium price, would I be happy with a major price decrease on popcorn with shit topping within the coming year?
Personally, if it came down to it, I'd pay more for the higher quality of bright, beautiful 2D (and butter).
Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:59 am
Speevy
Veteran
Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 9:12 am Posts: 3139
Re: The 3D thread
Um yeah, that comparison isn't even a valid one....
Wed Jun 22, 2011 2:06 am
David
Pure Phase
Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:33 am Posts: 34865 Location: Maryland
Re: The 3D thread
Stupid 3-D. Fuck George Lucas 2.0...er, I mean James Cameron.
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1. The Lost City of Z - 2. A Cure for Wellness - 3. Phantom Thread - 4. T2 Trainspotting - 5. Detroit - 6. Good Time - 7. The Beguiled - 8. The Florida Project - 9. Logan and 10. Molly's Game
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