you've got to watch part two of his performance at the superbowl very touching

As expected, all of MJ's songs have become extremely popular on iTunes again. Man in the Mirror is #5, Thriller is #6. As much as I adore Man in the Mirror, I didn't think that was one of his most well-regarded songs today...I guess it's doing so well at the moment because of its inspirational lyrics.

Okay...

who else has bought something related to Michael off itunes in the past 24 hours.

I just bought the Diana Ross presents the Jackson 5 album.

Witness the self-appointed guardians of a distorted form of morality as they act as roadside judge, jury, and executioner based on fifth hand reports from that most reliable purveyor of evidence, celebrity "journalism".

Watch as they swoop in like the vultures they are, as they smell the vulnerability of death. Watch as they slander an innocent man not yet in his grave.

Here we get to see the face of true evil, perversely disguised as "justice".

Sick.

Working with abused children doesn't mean you understand paedophiles Tony, it means you understand abused children. There have been many psychologists interviewed throughout his trial a few years ago, most determined that despite Michael's behaviour he had no traits of a child molester.

I do think Michael's troubled childhood, and the lack of one affected his own mental state. I mean look at the other stars who have led similar lifestyles. Most notably Britney Spears.

Until then keep your trap shut about things you know nothing about especially within 24 hours of his demise. So keep your *happy* thoughts to yourself.


**NOW GET THIS THREAD BACK ON TOPIC**

Dude, I grew up with a ton of abused kids in the projects. Half of my good friends were or I suspected were. But yes, I have no compassion or no radar for something going wrong. Give me a break. I didn't even outright say anything about MJ's molestation that indicated if I think he did it or not. Of course there's an great chance he did. We'll know for sure in the coming months, probably. I'm just not ready to burn the dead witch's body. It's not like all that DNA evidence for OJ. Of course I understand the cynicism and intuition you'll pick up as police. I'm not that naive.

Hey! What's the difference between Michael Jackson and Disney films? Disney films can still touch children.

If only the joke was funny.

I wonder if they even need to embalm him.

Maybe they'll melt him down into Legos so children can touch HIM for a change. After all, he's what, 99% plastic?

Your remark is based on opinion. Besides Im not talking about 1 or 2 album wonders which most of which is what you listed. Whats Alanis Morrisette or Mr Hottie and his blowfishes up to these days?

You just cant put Chuck Berry & Sinatra in the same candle as the Beatles, the King and King of Pop. Those 3 are universally known by non music fans and around the poorest countries in the world stretching almost every generation

You do understand that I work with both parts of the equation, right getluv? I work with both the abusers and the abused.

The very simple fact ALONE that MJ hung out with only boys of a VERY specific age is about the biggest red flag you could find. Add in the tons of other evidence - much of it right from MJ's mouth - and you'd have to be incredibly naive to not be able to put the pieces together here.

We like to think of pedos as dirty old scruffy men who lure kids in with candy. The truth is that 98% of the time they are trusted, beloved individuals. Most of the time, community members, family, and friends are EXTREMELY reluctant to believe it is a possibility.

I'm not even sure if any of you deny the possibility, but most of you seem to be saying "sure, he may have raped little boys, but let's forget that and talk about how great of an entertainer he was". I guess I just find it amazing some of you can separate that so easily.

The bigger picture, though, I think this just illustrates the complexity of MJ and looking at his career. As much as some of you want to push aside the molestation story, it will always be a big - and relevant - part of MJ's story. It brought down his career. It took him from the biggest star in pop music to mostly irrelevant for the past 15 years. It's not a chapter that's easily pushed aside.

And, as long as you guys want to keep addressing the issue, I'll do so. I'm only responding to your attacks on me. I'm happy to wait until the NAMBLA convention celebration of MJ's life dies down to go back to expressing my feelings about him.

Well, I think we all know most pedophiles aren't going out with these:



And yes, I don't deny the strong possibility/probability he was molesting, and I haven't once "celebrated" his life itself. I still love Off The Wall, though. Music doesn't get better than that, it only gets more complicated.

I dont know. Seems to me Michael Jackson had the personality of a 10 year old so sleeping in the same bed with other 9 year olds in a non sexual way is common to him. Other cultures they dont have problems with an entire family sharing the same bed but it grosses out most americans because their minds are always in the gutter. His profile doesnt seem to fit in with other convicted child molester rockstars like Gary Glitter

Man, I wish they would get vans like that... it would make our job a little easier.

And my comment was mostly directed at getluv, Tyler. You seem to be a very reasonable/decent individual (ie, not getluv).

Honestly, as I said before, I did love MJ in the 80's. Bought up most of his records, watched all his videos, and couldn't wait to see what he was going to do next. It makes me angry to think how he screwed up his carreer, and what we may have missed out on over the last 15 years.

Look at Madonna... while she may not be as hot as she was in the 80's, it's over 25+ years and she is still pumping out music to enjoy. How much more could have we gotten from Jackson if he kept his head on straight?

Yeah, my point is that he had such a Peter Pan complex that there's still the possibility lingering in my mind that he really just thought of himself as 10. And of course, there's plenty to exploit out of an insanely rich demi-god pop star with the mentality of a 10-year-old boy. Nobody was around to tell him "no dude, that's a bad idea". The dude was deeply fucked in the head either way. Otherwise, I'd have no doubt.

I also wonder what people would say if he was banging young girls instead. Remember Jerry Lee Lewis?

The Beatles and Elvis.

Again, if sharing a bed with a very specific age of boys was the absolute only shred of evidence on Jackson... I'd still think it's a strong possibility that he was a pedophile, but wouldn't be as certain. It's clearly not the only piece of the puzzle here.

Most child molestors do not look/act like Gary Glitter.

Yes! And not only was she 12 or 13... it was his cousin!

Was there physical evidence? I heard of the kids identifying his cock and balls, but that could be an urban legend.

I could identify Tony's genitalia...

There are reports coming out right now that he didn't die from a cardiac arrest after all. They are now saying it was FOOD POISONING!

It seems he ate a 9 year old wiener!

In the first case, the victim described MJ's genitals in detail, and supposedly there were unique features. The Police got a warrant and photgraphed MJ's privates. By all accounts things matched up, and they felt they had a pretty solid case on top of that.

MJ paid the victim millions, the victim then refused to co-operate with the criminal investigation. It was decided the criminal case could not go forward without a willing victim, and it was dropped.

Mine can be identified from space!

I'm not denying that those are qualities of paedophiles. And yes, maybe those allegations affected his career and most reports about MJ I have watched on the news have focussed on either his greatness and his issues (allegations, wives, demeanour, plastic surgery)

I'm arguing that there is a chance MJ differs from paedophiles because, while he did have a strong affection for 10-14 yo boys it was not sexual, he just wanted to be friends with them because he never had friends when he was child, being forced by his strict father to do something which stopped him from having a normal childhood. Furthermore, despite some lingering allegations, they are still allegations. And I'm not going to (and neither should you) make a judgement on someone where you don't have ALL the facts relating to those incidents, especially when all those allegations have been quashed in some shape or form. Yes there are lingering questions, but most issues have. Already, as previously stated, that most paedophile/child abuse psychologists agreed that whilst MJ was a disturbed individual, but showed no signs of being a paedophile.

My ability to discern this has nothing do with the fact about whether I loved him or not, because I really didn't care for him but enjoyed his music. He was a very odd man, and yes if I had children I probably wouldn't be asking him to babysit anytime soon. So jump off the bridge and be respectful because it is obvious you've already come to a conclusion, because you've had experience. Obviously there is a reason why police officers are not judges as well.

And I don't think those allegations were the sole purpose of his flagging career. If he wanted to he could tour and tour all the way during 2000-2003 but did not. In fact, there was a lot of bad blood between Sony (his label) and MJ during this period and could have just been he wanted to take a break. It was said that the Neverland Ranch was bleeding money ever since it was built.