Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
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Tyler
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Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:55 pm Posts: 7578 Location: Torrington, CT
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Doesn't the Academy tally by numbered ballots? That's why I have Frost/Nixon at #6 rather than #3. Even Michael Clayton had more than a few #1 supporters, and with less 100s, too.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:06 pm |
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snack
Extraordinary
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:18 pm Posts: 12159
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Clayton had Clooney and just widespread support in Hollywood that we've seen no indication of for Frost/Nixon yet.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:15 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
And it only has a $9k PTA in 42 theaters. Ouch. It's the Diving Bell of the year, methinks.
And you know what that means? TDK and WALL-E in BP! Celebrate!
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:16 pm |
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snack
Extraordinary
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:18 pm Posts: 12159
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Hmm, I don't know how great of a comparison Diving Bell is. Diving Bell did exceptionally well with the guilds but missed out on BP. Frost/Nixon shouldn't do fantastically with the guilds but is still in play for BP.
But anyways, I do agree that Frost/Nixon is the man out at the moment. If it stays out and BB trends negative for the next week or so (when more reviews/reception come out), which is unlikely, but still possible, our seemingly predictable BP lineup could attract an outsider. or so I hope. I'm always hoping. how futile.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:33 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
BB I think is pretty safe unless it flops next week.
As for Diving Bell, I mean a film that did great with precursors but simply did not have enough of a profile, which killed it. And that film actually had (many) passionate supporters.
Locks: 1. Slumdog Millionaire 2. Milk
Strong Alternatives: 3. WALL-E 4. The Curious Case Of Benjamin Button
With A Boost Of Varying Degrees: 5. The Dark Knight 6. Frost/Nixon 7. Doubt 8. The Wrestler 9. Gran Torino
The Lord Is My Shepherd, I Shall Not Want: 10. Revolutionary Road 11. Rachel Getting Married 12. Happy-Go-Lucky
Dead as a doornail: Australia, The Reader, Defiance, Valkyrie
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Last edited by Tyler on Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:45 pm |
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Loyal
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Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:43 pm Posts: 24502
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
the prevailing theory is that more voters will give TDK and WALL-E 1s and 2s, then anything lower. If you're likely to vote for either film, you're not going to bother with a 4 or 5.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:46 pm |
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snack
Extraordinary
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:18 pm Posts: 12159
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Anton Chigurh wrote: BB I think is pretty safe unless it flops next week.
As for Diving Bell, I mean a film that did great with precursors but simply did not have enough of a profile, which killed it. And that film actually had (many) passionate supporters. I still sort of can't believe that. It had SO MUCH support in the guilds relative to its size. There is SO MUCH overlap between the Academy and the guilds. But alas, the Academy seems to have larger British bloc than anyone else, and they had nowhere to run but to Atonement last year.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:48 pm |
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Loyal
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
This was posted over at AD Quote: Tom O’Neil at Gold Derby talks to several people about the chance of the little robot making it into the big five. Here is what Mark Harris had to say and then we can talk a bit about how the balloting works:
I think a big difference between this year and last year is that at the end of 2007 the number of movies with some sort of passionate following was pretty staggering. There were at least three live-action movies that didn’t get best picture nominations  “Into the Wild,†“Sweeney Todd,†“The Diving Bell and the Butterfly† that I would imagine had a substantial number of No. 1 votes. This year, I don’t sense that depth of support for that many movies. “Wall-E†is one of the few that I hear people discussing with real passion. It’ll be interesting to see if that adds up to votes.
So this is how they do it. Every Academy member who decides to turn in a ballot ranks their choices number 1 to 5. They first count the number of number one votes. I’ll leave the rest to Tom O’Neil in an article he wrote last year, just nevermind Sweeney Todd:
In order to be nominated, a film needs one-sixth of the votes plus one  that’s about 868 out of 5,200 votes. As soon as accountants figure that, say, “Sweeney Todd†reaps that tally, they stop counting and set those ballots aside, decreeing “Sweeney†a best pic nominee. The remaining ballots with “Sweeney†on top get distributed to other stacks based upon their second-ranked choices.
If no other movie has enough number-one votes or those number twos once the stray “Sweeney†ballots are re-distributed, then accountants turn to the movies with the fewest votes and redistribute those ballots based upon number-two votes.
Over and over they repeat the process, working from the smallest stacks to the largest, until a film has the magic 868 votes. Then counting for that film stops, the stack is set aside and the remaining ballots in that stack get re-distributed, too, based on the film with the highest next ranking. Over all, about a dozen rounds of redistribution occur before the five nominees are settled.
It’s easy to see Wall-E or even Dark Knight getting in under those conditions, eh? If all it needs is a minimum is of 868? Slumdog is a lock, but it may be the only one we can figure out at this point, without the DGA or the PGA. The PGA divides their awards, with animation given its own category - that might not help with determining Wall-E’s chances (unless it crosses over, but it probably won’t since there are two separate categories). Is it eligible for the DGA? I would assume so but I haven’t yet received confirmation.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:11 pm |
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Johnny Dollar
The Lubitsch Touch
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 5:48 pm Posts: 11019
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Man, I hope the little guy can do it.
Three cheers for Wall-E!
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:14 pm |
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Chippy
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Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:45 pm Posts: 63026 Location: Tonight... YOU!
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
WALL-E!!!
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:15 pm |
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Loyal
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
When you read exactly how votes are tallied, it does make a strong case for it getting in.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:15 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
And very bad for F/N.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:19 pm |
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Johnny Dollar
The Lubitsch Touch
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
The vote counting methodology always makes us think twice, but it usually doesn't play out that way. Seabuscuit? Good Night and Good Luck? I'd say both are similar to Frost/Nixon in terms of passion, but it didn't stop them.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:22 pm |
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Gulli
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Joined: Mon May 01, 2006 9:53 am Posts: 13403
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Reads like they use a form of proportional representation. Thats actually quite cool.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:20 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
yoshue wrote: The vote counting methodology always makes us think twice, but it usually doesn't play out that way. Seabuscuit? Good Night and Good Luck? I'd say both are similar to Frost/Nixon in terms of passion, but it didn't stop them. Seabiscuit was widely seen? Hell, it'd be impressive if Frost/Nixon made half of GNGL at this point.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:07 pm |
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Johnny Dollar
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Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 5:48 pm Posts: 11019
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Anton Chigurh wrote: yoshue wrote: The vote counting methodology always makes us think twice, but it usually doesn't play out that way. Seabuscuit? Good Night and Good Luck? I'd say both are similar to Frost/Nixon in terms of passion, but it didn't stop them. Seabiscuit was widely seen? Hell, it'd be impressive if Frost/Nixon made half of GNGL at this point. But we're talking about degree of passion, not breadth of exposure.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:10 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
"But it didn't stop them." I assumed you were talking about their BP nominations. In which case, passion is only one factor.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:55 pm |
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roo
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:44 pm Posts: 6194
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Anton Chigurh wrote: yoshue wrote: The vote counting methodology always makes us think twice, but it usually doesn't play out that way. Seabuscuit? Good Night and Good Luck? I'd say both are similar to Frost/Nixon in terms of passion, but it didn't stop them. Seabiscuit was widely seen? Hell, it'd be impressive if Frost/Nixon made half of GNGL at this point. "Widely seen" by the academy is quite different than public box office, since there are special screenings, etc. We need to assume that an Academy member has equal opportunity to see all of the films that are delivered to him/her.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:56 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Yes, but public box office also correlates to how much campaigning there is, though. And we all know how important campaigning is (it's probably the reason why RR is on life support).
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:35 pm |
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roo
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Anton Chigurh wrote: Yes, but public box office also correlates to how much campaigning there is, though. And we all know how important campaigning is (it's probably the reason why RR is on life support). Not necessarily true, because for many of the films, campaigning is done before the results of Box Office are known. Internally, these companies know how good their films are and know how hard they can push. In my opinion, as I've stated elsewhere, box office *can* be a boon to a large film, although in the end it could mean shit. You could pull stats that read various ways. It depends film to film in my opinion. None of the films except The Dark Knight is relying to heavy on it this year (BB already has enough critic awards to qualify).
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:09 pm |
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Tyler
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
That's true for late-release films like TWBB. Frost/Nixon doesn't really qualify for that, though.
If BB only ended up with like $60 million I'd say it'd be in very bad shape.
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Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:15 pm |
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snack
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Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:18 pm Posts: 12159
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
So...at this point I actually feel like Wall-E is safe. crazy.
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Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:44 am |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
RT UPDATE:
Revolutionary Road
77% with 7.1/10 (35 reviews) and COTC 86% with 7.1/10
I think it shows that it is well received...but not exceptionally so. Explains a bit more.
The Wrestler
98% with 8.1/10 (82 reviews) and COTC 94% with 7.8/10
Very very good so far.
Milk
93% with 8/10 (155 reviews) and COTC 91% with 8.3/10
The COTC average grade shows pasionate support.
Slumdog Millionaire
93% with 8.2/10 (147 reviews) and COTC 94% with 8.2/10
The Curious Case of Benjamin Button
74% with 7/10 (42 reviews) and COTC 88% with 7/10
I dunno...it doesn't look good at all. It needs more passionate support.
Doubt
75% with 6.8/10 (112 reviews) and COTC 74% with 6.5/10
It actually kinda rebounded and with HUGE SAG support...can it get back into the race?
The Reader
54% with 5.9/10 (69 reviews) and COTC 42% with 5.4/10
Bleh...and this got several major GG noms?! It's out for everything except for a Winslet nom, I'd say.
Gran Torino
73% with 6.7% (66 reviews) and COTC 75% (6.8/10)
Changeling
59% with 6.2/10 (172 reviews) and COTC 44% with 5.7/10
I find it funny that it actually cralwed back up all the way to almost 60% now.
Frost/Nixon
90% with 7.6/10 (126 reviews) and COTC 88% with 7.5/10
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Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:30 pm |
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Johnny Dollar
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Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 5:48 pm Posts: 11019
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Slumdog will win Best Picture. Van Sant will win Best Director.
Take it to the bank, yo.
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Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:32 pm |
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Dr. Lecter
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Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: Well...the 2008 Contenders Discussion Thread
Gay-themed films always doomed to win best Director, but not Picture? I don't think so.
Whatever wins BP, Boyle is winning Best Director.
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Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:33 pm |
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