Where did I say that it being a more faihtful adaptation makes it Oscar-worthy?[/quote]

You said that it being a faithful adaptation is what makes the film so splendid and great, and earlier you said that it deserves to be nominated for Best Picture at the Oscars (thereby saying it is "Oscar worthy"). I simply put two and two together.

PEACE, Mike

They're not connected. I think it's confusing because my post is in a thread that talks about the film's Oscar nomination chances. Anyways, BKB, where did you get that from?

Lol, Mike, I think it''s not worth us making a big deal out of it; the Academy will pick whichever films it sees fit for nominations.

Btw, does anyone remember Sixth Sense getting a nomination over Fight Club and Matrix, among others? I think Fight Club only got serious attention rather slowly after its release.

Fight Club wasn't very well recieved until DVD anyway.

http://www.joblo.com/forums/showthread. ... adid=87066

The 1st post on this link says it.. I agree and BUMPING this thread up to.. SPIDERMAN II should win BEST PICTURE cause it was BEST PICTURE Material for Comics the way LOTR was BEST PICTURE Material to Fantasy.. =D>

Mike, how can you even say that, when you had absolutely no problems with LOTR (a popcorn fantasy movie) getting nominated THREE strait years, in which two of those years could have been given to other Oscar worthy films. The last two years, neither TTT or ROTK were as flawless in their execution as Spider-Man 2, yet you never took this stand about other deserving movies being left off. Kinda funny, huh?

Well, i dont see anything wrong with spiderman 2 being nominated .. my personal opinion of spidey 2 is that it was inferior to 1 in many aspects. it has everything going for it that makes it oscar worthy but i had too many issues with the movie to not enjoy it as much as a lot of other people had.

Well my personal opinion is that unlike Lord of the Rings (three pieces or all together), which I think is as flawless as Best Picture canidates get, Spider-Man I or II is nowhere in the league of being nomination worthy. It's story was too unfocused, repetative, the script too whiney. Dr. Ock was underused and shifted to being a henchman.

If you were going to nominate a superhero movie, nominate The Incredibles instead. I have no problems with a film like Spider-Man getting nominations or a win for best picture, just not that specific example.

Then I suggest you pick up a SPIDERMAN Comic and read it cause that's what the comics were like and Raimi lifted the movies right out of the comics.. Bottom line: SPIDERMAN II deserves the nod over The Incredibles.. =D>

I see Spider-Man (1 or 2)as a much more focused and better constructed movie than anything in the LOTR movies, especially that theatrical turd that won best picture. I also think that the script was much more whiney. Just listen to Sam, or any of the hobbits, and you'll be hard pressed to make a case against another movie having a script that's more whiney.

Haha, nice try. You can go ahead and equate Spider-Man II to Lord of the Rings, but in my opinion, Lord of the Rings was much better film, in story, emotion, and BIG time in acting (Tobey Maguire makes me cringe), as well as being far more successful in technical aspects. I don't want to get into it all , but obviously, that's my opinion, just like I expressed my opinion on Spider-Man II being suggested for Best Picture consideration a ridiculous suggestion. You can go ahead and disagree, but stop trying to insert your opinion as mine.

PEACE, Mike

Sounds like you are backtracking now, and now it's just your "opinion". What happened to the F word that you used in your very first sentence?

"Besides the fact that Spider-Man II is not even close to being Oscar worthy"

Since when did your opinion become the be all end all fact, and when you say stuff like that, you should expect me to respond, and I am up for a debate on the merits of Spider-Man 2 vrs. the theatrical ROTK anytime. There are countless holes to be poked in that slopfest of a movie. \:D/

I actually shouldn't be so harsh. It was a decent popcorn flick. Nothing special, but decent, plot holes and all.

The ACADEMY is who decides whether a film is Oscar worthy. Seeing as how Spider-Man II isn't even close to being nominated for Best Picture at the Oscars, it is not even close to being Oscar worthy. If Ebert had recommended the Academy to nominate Ray or Eternal Sunshine or something along those lines, a film that is close to being Oscar "worthy", then I would have not have made that statement, because these films are incredibly well received and have always been possibilities in the running. There is a huge difference between films like Ray/Eternal Sunshine and Spider-Man II when it comes to the awards season and their general Oscar worthiness according to the Academy, and you can't dispute that. They're not on the same level at all. I did not say it was a fact that Spider-Man II is a bad film, because I don't think it is, and even if I felt that way, it's just my opinion, but it's definately not even close to being Oscar worthy, that's for sure.

As to Lord of the Rings, you can have whatever opinion you want in regards to the film. It's your opinion, and I really don't care, because after your whole campaign over the years about the film, I think you have lost a lot of merit anyways.

The way you try to feed things into my mouth is really irritating. Fire away with the insults or whatever you have next, I'm done.

PEACE, Mike

And fantasy movies with elves and goblins and dwarves, trolls, giant eagles, and wizards are academy worthy pictures? They were according to recent history.

As far as LOTR, I don't think I really care if I have merit with anybody who blindly defends the films as a religious experience. I haven't had any campaigns against the movies for years, just the nonsensical fans who trash everything while acting as if LOTR is more than what it is. I think if anybody has lost merit, it's the people who blindly defend the movies, without even looking at other POV, and instead, brush them off as the ramblings of somebody with an agenda. I can back up every claim I've ever made against those movies, as I've done in the past, only to watch those fans do cartwheels trying to convince me how wrong I am and how perfect the movies are.

And I'm not feeding things into your mouth. You are getting a little too upset about nothing , if you're irritated. And I never fired away with insults toward you, so I have no idea why you would think that I would. :???:

You are talking out of both sides of your mouth. Your second quote is actually from an earlier paragraph in this post, where you generally insult people who like Lord of the Rings by claiming it's a nonsensical religious experience. Mike Q, myself, etc. do not "trash everything", we just like certain films and don't like others. I do not like Spider-Man, but we're not creating topics of hatred or obsessing about it like you and others do.

You are acting like a 10 year old shit. And you absolutely NEED to stop. It's gone on for three years, and I have the impression that you are completely oblivious of it.

You come into topics with people like me, Mike Q, etc. throwing shit at these films, we put up good responses that are not meant to brainwash you, only add to the discussion which you USUALLY start and then you backtrack by claiming that all there is to the films is a "religious experience" or that we are "nonsensical fans". If that's not what you think then you need to either back down or speak to more specifics.

I honestly don't really give a care whether or not you liked Lord of the Rings, but do NOT say these movies were not worthy of their accolades and then put down every single response as the raving of fanboys because you personally don't agree with it.

You are a troll Mav. Using the term slopfest and then \:D/ is meant to irritate people. Then you try to retreat to the high ground after you have irritated.

It's sad. You need to step up a little.

I praise you for taking everything from my train of thought and putting it in the best words possible.
Countless times I have tried to write a post like that everytime Mav gets on my last wire, but I can never get it going good and give up.

I agree with every bit of that post.

Bleh, I love Sm2 but consider the LOTR films to be superior. They're source material is better, and is the stuff that, literally, legends are made of.


As I stated somewhere above, I think SM2 is a better adaptation in that it is in many ways more faithful, however, LOTR's source material is superior to begin with, and is properly re-imagined onto the screen. Peter Jackson did a tremendous job, and his best director Oscar is easily among the most deserving awards ever handed by the Academy. The special effects, the music, etc. all deserved their Oscarcs, if by 'deserved' we mean to indicate the acknowledgement of extraordinary achievements at the highest level. LOTR not only gets that high up, I think that, like Star Wars, it re-defines the standard.


Anyways, good luck to all the films. Hopefully some of the smaller ones will get some added coverage due to nominations. The Academy did a great job selecting nominees and winners last year. I mean, nominating Keisha? Shoreh? How refreshing is that?

Cheers!


P.S., there is one thing that I would have liked the LOTR crew to have gotten: an esemble Oscar. I don't know why there isn't an Oscar for ensemble, it makes such good sense. Those guys (and gals \:D/ ) did such an astonishingly good job elevating the fantasy genre to a whole different level, especially McKellen and the hobbits. It makes me wish I was a kid when the films came out, so that they could have swept me away the way The Lion King and Jurassic Park once did.

You only seem to get upset when it's LOTR, so when you and raffi and whoever else goes into one of these rants, I just laugh about it. If this was a stance you took over everything, it wouldn't just look as if your ship was thrown off course over LOTR. Jump in somebody's face who makes a habit out of Star Wars bashing, and I'll care about your plight, but jump in my face about LOTR while letting the others go by, a \:D/ is the best you'll get from me.

And it hasn't been 3 years, it's been 1 1/2 years, and I haven't been trolling. That's what BKB does.

(edit) *sigh*. I don't need to prove anything.

Good, then relax, and enjoy yourself. I want to see this kind of determination when EP III comes out, but you know what, all of the sudden, there won't be any grandstanding going on about trolls and whatnot, it will be encouraged and accepted as the right of the member who is bashing. If there is a stand taken against EP III bashing and trolling, and not just once, but everytime, you'll never see me say another negative thing about another movie ever again. :grin:

\:D/ That's right..

No no no, you don't get to say things like this to me. Not until you have respect for the members of this forum enough to create an atmosphere where there is discussion and not polarize issues.


I don't encourage any sort of bashing, even of things like Alien vs. Predator. I've done it in the past, and I've been (rightly) called on it.


You admit to trolling here. When you said previously that that was the domain of BKB. Hypocrite.

yes yes yes...I do say things like that to you, especially since your hypocrisy is running rampant. Look back at this thread, and notice how you never made one comment about the people making their anti Spider-man comments. In fact, you chimed in with some of your own, didn't you? I guess you were doing your part to try to create that wonderful atmosphere you spoke of, as you tried to point the finger of blame at me. When it's negative comments about anything but LOTR, you consider it "an opinion", but when it's against LOTR, it's "an agenda".



I think my above post pretty much shows the lengths you've went to to encourage it in this very thread. The proof is all right here. You said NOTHING about any negative Spider-Man comments, encouraged more by making some of your own, and then started throwing a fit as if it was my fault for attacking the precious. It's in black and white, so happy reading.



How is that admitting to trolling? So anybody with an opinion that isn't LOTR is the greatest film in history is a troll, and anybody with an opinion like that about another movie is just voicing an opinion that they have a right to voice? I merely voiced an opinion, and if you can't handle opinions that are different from yours, to the point that you have to start labeling those who have different views, that's just sad, especially considering the facts that are right in this very thread. After you reread this thread in it's entirety, I think that even you might be a little embarrassed about using the word hypocrite to describe anybody, because you just put on a clinic.

I'd like to say one thing that Maverikk seems to always use...
He claims in all his arguments or he mentions the swarms or great number of fanboys saying Lord of the Rings is the best movie ever made. You exaggerate it either intentionally or you've brainwahsed urself to believe that.

there are only a handful of posters to whom you always refer that are crazy fanboys who think LOTR is the best movie ever made.
A great deal of them are LOTR fans who don't think it's the best movie ever made, who think it could have been better, but for what it is, it's one of the greatest achievments in cinema or adaptations to film.

Then there are also those who really aren't big fans but do acknowledge the strength in film-making involved and defend the Best Picture, Director and some tech awards, while not agreeing to the sweep.

You categorize ALL these different types of people into one category and those who are LOTR nuts and it goes on un-debated but it really is an important aspect of this laughable exchange of arguments. I think it's important to note that everyone has a different opinion and while it doesn't really matter because your motives are more fanboysih than any of ours and your arguments don't have merit, it should be pointed out and not be let for your advantage.

And don't bother trying to take anything apart in my post, I won't even read it.

I'll bet you do read it. \:D/ You are seriously delusioned. I only categorize the blind defenders, which there are many. Your post means nothing, because you're very biased. Let's break this down, shall we?

The World According to Raffiki
A "handful" think that LOTR are the best films ever made (maybe all those people who have listed one of them as #1 were just bad typists, and we can chalk it up to a typo, or maybe you think people have hands the size of King Kong.)

A "great deal" of them think it could have been better, BUT still think it's one of the greatest achievements in movie history.

The ones who "aren't great fans" STILL acknowledge the greatness, because it's greatness is so strong that they had to admit they were wrong for being doubting Thomases, because the movies are brilliant.

All in all, you have just claimed that EVERYBODY thinks that LOTR are incredible films, all while trying to explain to us how I'm exaggerating. And what do you know, not a mention of those who weren't impressed. I guess they don't exist in your world. =;

Forth Eorlingas!