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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
I smell a conspiracy...
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:11 pm |
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trixster
loyalfromlondon
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:31 pm Posts: 19697 Location: ville-marie
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
You fucking ruined the poll, Lecter. 
_________________Magic Mike wrote: zwackerm wrote: If John Wick 2 even makes 30 million I will eat 1,000 shoes. Same. Algren wrote: I don't think. I predict. 
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Thu Mar 20, 2008 5:37 pm |
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2001
Another You
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:38 am Posts: 4556
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Wow, I never wouLd have thought a fiLm with such unusuaL and uninteresting setting (add to that Lots of diaLogue with no action, vioLence whatsoever) couLd generate me great amounts of invoLvement in a fiLm. It may not be the aLL-time cLassic as some of you might say, but it sure posts a benchmark in terms of fiLm and entertainment in generaL.
B+
For the record, though I've seen very few, this is the onLy pre-1960 B&W movie I've truLy appreciated so far aLong with MetropoLis (fuck those Humphrey Bogart fiLms and The Third Man)
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Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:59 am |
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Mannyisthebest
Forum General
Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 3:53 pm Posts: 8642 Location: Toronto, Canada
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
lol the Third Man pisses me off.
Damn Orson Wells thinks he is so cool.
I love the Sunset Blvd style BW picture.
_________________The Dark Prince 
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Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:30 pm |
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trixster
loyalfromlondon
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:31 pm Posts: 19697 Location: ville-marie
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
You guys are on crack.
The Third Man is amazing.
_________________Magic Mike wrote: zwackerm wrote: If John Wick 2 even makes 30 million I will eat 1,000 shoes. Same. Algren wrote: I don't think. I predict. 
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Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:22 am |
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Mannyisthebest
Forum General
Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 3:53 pm Posts: 8642 Location: Toronto, Canada
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
It is but Orson Wells thinks he is so cool...
I still remember the shot when he is introduced.
He acted like he was the King.
_________________The Dark Prince 
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Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:27 am |
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kypade
Kypade
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 7908
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
trixster wrote: You guys are on crack.
The Third Man is amazing. It's no 12 Angry Men, that's for sure. And Orson Welles is king. 
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Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:30 am |
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Michael A
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 4:48 am Posts: 6245
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
The entire film I wrestled with just how much I liked it. At moments I couldn't help surrendering to Lecter's school of thought that, while this was great, 12 was actually better. Mikhalkov just seemed more bound and determined to create a great film and incredible piece of art than Lumet was. Also, Mikhalkov's insistence upon metaphors and artistic revelations was more persistent and was placed strategically all throughout the film. Until about the last 20 minutes I was somewhere between a 4 and 5 for this, most likely a 4, whereas Mikhalkov's remake just missed the "perfect 10" mark. For a lot of this film it felt like Lumet was simply telling the story, without much conviction or effort. He did an excellent job of this, make no mistake, he just didn't seem to be trying that hard.
The acting in both films was fantastic, and I think, even by the end I slightly prefferred the adopted script in Mikhalkov's film than Lumet's, although both were magnificent scripts. So basically, it boiled down to the directing. Lumet didn't impress me all that much for the first 75 minutes of the movie. Like I said, he was good, just not astonishing. Whereas Mikhalkov desperately tried to be excellent, and rarely missed the mark.
It is the last 20 minutes that make this film one of the greatest movies I've seen. Lumet really busts out all the stops, the speech where the "racist" guy just keeps ranting and they all slowly turn against him is brilliant. And the scene where the guy who hates his son finally gives in is absolutely riveting. Not to mention the closing sequence, where they walk through this great hall, as if Lumet is saying "they did this little thing, and while it is tiny compared to the world, it is still important." And I just loved that no one revealed a single name till the last scene.
A perfect 10
_________________Mr. R wrote: Malcolm wrote: You seem to think threatening violence against people is perfectly okay because you feel offended by their words, so that's kind of telling in itself. Exactly. If they don't know how to behave, and feel OK offending others, they get their ass kicked, so they'll think next time before opening their rotten mouths.
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Thu May 21, 2009 9:50 pm |
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Argos
Z
Joined: Sat May 13, 2006 2:20 pm Posts: 7952 Location: Wherever he went, including here, it was against his better judgment.
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
10 points.
I just saw a trailer for '12' which convinced me that Dr. Lecter is, as usual, wrong.
_________________ "Der Lebenslauf des Menschen besteht darin, dass er, von der Hoffnung genarrt, dem Tod in die Arme tanzt." - Arthur Schopenhauer
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Fri May 22, 2009 3:13 am |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Argos wrote: 10 points.
I just saw a trailer for '12' which convinced me that Dr. Lecter is, as usual, wrong. Because you certainly are familiar with cultural thematics in 12.
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Sat May 23, 2009 8:08 pm |
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Argos
Z
Joined: Sat May 13, 2006 2:20 pm Posts: 7952 Location: Wherever he went, including here, it was against his better judgment.
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
No, certainly not because of that.
_________________ "Der Lebenslauf des Menschen besteht darin, dass er, von der Hoffnung genarrt, dem Tod in die Arme tanzt." - Arthur Schopenhauer
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Sat May 23, 2009 11:17 pm |
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Tyler
Powered By Hate
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:55 pm Posts: 7578 Location: Torrington, CT
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Did somebody just badmouth Treasure Of The Sierra Madre? I won't allow that.
_________________ It's my lucky crack pipe.
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Sun May 24, 2009 12:21 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm Posts: 68365
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12 Angry Men
Heard a lot about this film over the years. People claiming that it's great, me seeing it on many Top 100 lists both here and on film sites, it even sits at #6 in IMDB's Top 250. Now I've finally seen it. I do not think I have ever seen such a perfectly crafted dialogue-heavy masterpiece as 12 Angry Men. It is impeccable in conveying a sequence of events through debate, and each character's personality is not only unique, but relatable. Whether it's New York City or York City, everybody knows individuals who exert those same qualities; it's what makes us human. No wonder writer Reginald Rose was nominated for an Oscar; a film that captures people and scoops them up for the ride without ever even having to show said ride is very special indeed. Imagination remains the most powerful part of one's enjoyment of film, and today's films do not use it enough (if at all). Henry Fonda is, of course, my favourite, as I expect he is of most people that like the movie. But Robert Webber was also very good. His flip-flopping attitude is well designed, and very true of the sort of attention-seeking suave ad agent that he plays. He doesn't really care either way (neither does the baseball fan), he just wants to tell jokes and seem part of the "in crew". Lee Cobb and Ed Begley also give special performances. They show traits that are even stronger (to a certain degree) in today's society, and I think that (along with other elements) is what makes 12 Angry Men a timeless classic. Then there's the technical side; I must have counted a 9-minute take at one point. Long shots point to toward many talented individuals, not only the director, but the actors and crew all being on-point for such a period. I loved it. Every minute of it.
A+
_________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG FIGHT FOR TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE FREE TIBET LIBERATE HONG KONG BOYCOTT MADE IN CHINA
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 6:19 am |
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stuffp
Keeping it Light
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:06 am Posts: 11642 Location: Bright Falls
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
I saw this a few years ago, and it's the only 50's movies I've seen if I remember well. It's really great, and it surprised how much I liked it. Generally I just don't bother for old movies, but I felt I had to see this one too. And it's certainly very good. I just didn't feel it was that amazing either, it's really well made, well acted, interesting, I'll remember it, but it didn't consume me.
A-
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:11 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm Posts: 68365
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
How the fuck do you give a movie an A- with THAT review???
_________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG FIGHT FOR TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE FREE TIBET LIBERATE HONG KONG BOYCOTT MADE IN CHINA
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 6:35 pm |
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stuffp
Keeping it Light
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:06 am Posts: 11642 Location: Bright Falls
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
It's just not up to the level of the best movies I see of each year.
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:38 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm Posts: 68365
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Yeah ... so why the A-? I mean, if you don't really think it's great, don't grade it high just because it's #6 in IMDB's Top 250. 
_________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG FIGHT FOR TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE FREE TIBET LIBERATE HONG KONG BOYCOTT MADE IN CHINA
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:09 pm |
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stuffp
Keeping it Light
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:06 am Posts: 11642 Location: Bright Falls
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Algren wrote: Yeah ... so why the A-? I mean, if you don't really think it's great, don't grade it high just because it's #6 in IMDB's Top 250.  It's overrated, but still worthy of the A category. I'd put in the top 200/ top 150 of best movies I've seen. It's better than a B+ (i.e. Grand Budapest Hotel, Dawn of the Planet of the Apes, Man of Steel, The Avengers, The Expendables 2 etc.)
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:31 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm Posts: 68365
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Yeah, you see, everything you say about the film gives me the impression that you don't actually think it is that great. And comparing it to The Avengers and The Expendables 2 is just mind-boggling. 
_________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG FIGHT FOR TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE FREE TIBET LIBERATE HONG KONG BOYCOTT MADE IN CHINA
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Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:35 pm |
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stuffp
Keeping it Light
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:06 am Posts: 11642 Location: Bright Falls
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
It's better than those movies. It's closer to an A then a B+....although I did consider a B+, but I couldn't get my head wrapped around that...it's better than that. It's really good, but I do disagree that it's a master piece. Algren wrote: the technical side I didn't notice any of this, so therefore I can't give it any points for that. Algren wrote: I loved it. Every minute of it. But with this I agree. The movies gets your attention and doesn't let it go, but I missed a great score, or some more thrilling story to put it over the top and give it an A. Considering recent movies, I felt it's quite comparable with Birdman. They are both good in their own way, but no really that much happens, and it just comes down to the actors to lift up this type of film, which they did very well. For the directing style of those movies, it's not something I cared much for.
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Mon Jul 27, 2015 12:56 am |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm Posts: 68365
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Okay.
Birdman is technically brilliant. The performances are also superb, but if not for the technical gimmick I don't see people fawning over it as they did.
_________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG FIGHT FOR TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE FREE TIBET LIBERATE HONG KONG BOYCOTT MADE IN CHINA
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Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:09 am |
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Mister Ecks
New Server, Same X
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:07 pm Posts: 28301 Location: ... siiiigh...
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Embarrassed to admit that today was the first time I've ever seen 12 Angry Men. I knew the story, knew the outcome, knew it was a classic. Heck, I'd even seen 12 Angry Men Inside Amy Schumer first.
Anyway, I don't really have a lengthy review for it. Everyone echoes my sentiments in this thread. It's close to perfection. It unfolds quietly and gently at first, then with ferocity and determination, over the course of 100 minutes. Of course even someone living under a rock with no knowledge of the film would guess how it will end, yet it's the journey getting there. How will Henry Fonda convince 11 others of his case for Not Guilty? Who will crack first? Who will hang on the longest?
Loved it.
A
_________________ Ecks Factor: Cancelled too soon
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Thu Aug 20, 2015 3:38 pm |
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Darth Indiana Bond
007
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:43 pm Posts: 11619 Location: Wouldn't you like to know
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 Re: 12 Angry Men
Algren wrote: Okay.
Birdman is technically brilliant. The performances are also superb, but if not for the technical gimmick I don't see people fawning over it as they did. Birrrrrrrrrman! Fucking love that movie.
_________________
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Thu Aug 20, 2015 4:48 pm |
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