Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
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Tuukka
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:35 am Posts: 1830 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Algren wrote: Tuukka wrote: The fact that it has no pre-existing brand value is pretty meaningless. Thor, Captain America and Iron Man didn't have any worthy pre-established brand value either. That's just not true. They had about 60 years of being in the public's conciousness - they are the big superheroes that everyone knows the names of. Nobody (apart from geeky comicbook readers of this specific comic) knows who Drax and Gamora are, and nobody cares to see a movie about them either, especially one that has a talking raccoon.  Come on now, nobody outside of the comic book circles knew who they were. I'm someone who actually used to regularly read FF, X-men, Spidey, etc, when I was younger. And even I didn't know who Iron Man or Thor were, before the movies were announced. I had vaguely heard of Captain America, I think he had a quick cameo in one of the X-men stories I read, but I didn't give a shit about his character based on that cameo. And I'm 30 times more knowledgeable about geeky superhero comics than your standard moviegoer. The fact is, only the 1st tiers like Superman, Batman and Spiderman had major brand value even before their movies got out. The 2nd tiers like FF or X-men had some brand value. 3rd tiers like Iron Man had none. Iron Man opened big, because the premise is cool and distinctive, and the film looked awesome. They sold the film on its own terms, and it just happened to be a great package to sell. It doesn't make a slightest difference if you're a 3rd or 4th tier superhero. Mainstream audiences will accept you based on the movie, they have never read the comics.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:41 pm |
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_axiom
The Wall
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 10:50 am Posts: 16163 Location: Croatia
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I don't read comics, yet I knew of Iron Man, Thor and Captain America since I was a kid. Iron Man I knew of because of the cartoon show in the 90s that was very popular here. I first learned of Thor when we had lessons about Norse mythology in elementary school (yes, it's not connected with Marvel, but it's still the same character and you don't need to know about Marvel to know about Thor). Though I must admit that I don't remember how actually I found out about Captain America. Tuukka wrote: The fact that it's an epic scifi adventure film should work to its benefit. That's not a benefit. You do know that epic sci-fi adventures kinda bomb by default in this day and age?
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:58 pm |
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MadGez
Dont Mess with the Gez
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 9:54 am Posts: 23386 Location: Melbourne Australia
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Yeah I knew Thor, Captain America and Iron Man well as a kid and I wasn't a comic book geek either. Offcourse, Spider-man, Batman, Superman and Hulk were the big FOUR at the time.
But perhaps in Germany where Mark is from its a different story.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:59 pm |
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MadGez
Dont Mess with the Gez
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 9:54 am Posts: 23386 Location: Melbourne Australia
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I had one of these as a kid in the 80s and had a set of Marvel round paper disc things that you would view in it. Captain America and Thor were my favourites. 
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 7:02 pm |
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_axiom
The Wall
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 10:50 am Posts: 16163 Location: Croatia
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
MadGez wrote: But perhaps in Germany where Mark is from its a different story. Is Tuuka also named Mark or you made a mistake and think this was written by mark66? 
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 7:05 pm |
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MadGez
Dont Mess with the Gez
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 9:54 am Posts: 23386 Location: Melbourne Australia
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
_axiom wrote: MadGez wrote: But perhaps in Germany where Mark is from its a different story. Is Tuuka also named Mark or you made a mistake and think this was written by mark66?  Ah  I knew it was Tuuka but then must have thought of Mark66 when I typed the post. I'll replace Germany with Finland.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 7:08 pm |
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Tuukka
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:35 am Posts: 1830 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Dudes... It's completely irrelevant whether YOU knew who those superheroes are. You were all nerds when you were younger, most of you are still nerds. That's why you visit a nerdy B.O site to have nerdy discussions with other nerds, about superhero movies nobody in the mainstream has (yet) even heard of.
The fact that we are even having this discussion in here means that none of us is representative of the mainstream population, when it comes to things like Superhero comics.
Yes, I have a blatantly nerdy past as well. I know a shitload of nerdy things that the mainstream has never heard of. That's why I'm here, wasting my time by obsessing over nerdy things, just like the rest of you.
By their own admittance, even Jon Favreau and Robert Downey Jr. had never heard of Iron Man, before the film was offered to them.
Thor of course is a world famous character, due to Norse myths. But the Marvel Thor is an entirely different character, with an entirely different mythology surrounding him, than the original Norse myth character.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 8:39 pm |
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Tuukka
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:35 am Posts: 1830 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
BTW, guess what was the circulation for Iron Man, at its peak?
A whopping 200.000, in the mid 80's. Mostly it was just around 50.000-100.000. That's not mainstream, not in a country of 314 million. Those are very niche numbers.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 8:50 pm |
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nnairol
Newbie
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:42 pm Posts: 3
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I'm a 30 year old American female who has never read a comic book in her life, and I would say that Iron Man and Captain America were pretty well known by mainstream audiences before movies were made about them. Thor is a recognizable name that you learn about in school, even if you don't know about the comic books. On the other hand, I had never heard of Guardians of the Galaxy in my entire life until Chris Pratt was cast in the lead role (I'm a Parks and Recreation fan). IMO, Guardians of the Galaxy is much less known among mainstream audiences than Iron Man, Captain America, or Thor.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:17 pm |
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Caius
A very honest-hearted fellow
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm Posts: 4767
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
nnairol wrote: I'm a 30 year old American female who has never read a comic book in her life, and I would say that Iron Man and Captain America were pretty well known by mainstream audiences before movies were made about them. Thor is a recognizable name that you learn about in school, even if you don't know about the comic books. On the other hand, I had never heard of Guardians of the Galaxy in my entire life until Chris Pratt was cast in the lead role (I'm a Parks and Recreation fan). IMO, Guardians of the Galaxy is much less known among mainstream audiences than Iron Man, Captain America, or Thor. Interesting that you have two posts and this is one of them. Agree with your point.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:50 pm |
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Tuukka
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:35 am Posts: 1830 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Nnairol, you're an adult woman who posts at Worlfokj, and makes it a point after 7 years of absence to post her 2nd ever post, about a superhero movie nobody has (yet) even heard of. And you're doing it must to make it known that you knew nerdy superhero comics even before they became popular. I admit, it is kind of awesome what you are doing, and maybe some day I will want to marry you. But you're even weirder than the rest of us. In a good way, I guess.
Regardless, so you people would actually agree, that not only only you always knew Iron Man, but all the girls in your class, your teachers, you parents, your grandparents, your boss, your working partners, your neighbors, they ALL knew Iron Man? Your plumper knew Iron Man, as did the waitresses in your local restaurant, the pastor at your church, and the guy who fixed your car. When you went to a nightclub, everyone knew Iron Man. When you had sex with a girl for the first time, she knew Iron Man.
Because that's what real mainstream awareness is. All those people knew Superman, Batman, Spiderman and Hulk.
If everyone indeed knew Iron Man, how did they know him? The comic ever only got 200.000 in circulation. Was is the animated series that run from 1994 to 1995? The one that was poorly received both by critics and fans, got bad ratings, and was then cancelled?
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 10:23 pm |
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Caius
A very honest-hearted fellow
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm Posts: 4767
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Tuukka wrote: Nnairol, you're an adult woman who posts at Worlfokj, and makes it a point after 7 years of absence to post her 2nd ever post, about a superhero movie nobody has (yet) even heard of. And you're doing it must to make it known that you knew nerdy superhero comics even before they became popular. I admit, it is kind of awesome what you are doing, and maybe some day I will want to marry you. But you're even weirder than the rest of us. In a good way, I guess.
Regardless, so you people would actually agree, that not only only you always knew Iron Man, but all the girls in your class, your teachers, you parents, your grandparents, your boss, your working partners, your neighbors, they ALL knew Iron Man? Your plumper knew Iron Man, as did the waitresses in your local restaurant, the pastor at your church, and the guy who fixed your car. When you went to a nightclub, everyone knew Iron Man. When you had sex with a girl for the first time, she knew Iron Man.
Because that's what real mainstream awareness is. All those people knew Superman, Batman, Spiderman and Hulk.
If everyone indeed knew Iron Man, how did they know him? The comic ever only got 200.000 in circulation. Was is the animated series that run from 1994 to 1995? The one that was poorly received both by critics and fans, got bad ratings, and was then cancelled? 42% can name the three branches of government and 20% think the sun revolves around the earth. Imputed knowledge expectations for [US] society need to be lowered.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 11:38 pm |
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MadGez
Dont Mess with the Gez
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 9:54 am Posts: 23386 Location: Melbourne Australia
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I don't think anyone is saying that Tuuka. The second and third tier heroes are just that among the general public. However, the likes of Iron Man, Thor, Captain America caught on because there were other aspects that made them appealing to the general public as well as the die hard followers.
In regards to Guardians of the Galaxy - I would say they are 4th tier (I hadn't heard of them until the film was announced). I can see it being a hit though thanks to a.) being tied into the MCU and b.) looking interesting enough to raise the curiosity of general auds.
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Wed Jan 01, 2014 11:42 pm |
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nnairol
Newbie
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 12:42 pm Posts: 3
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I'm bored, and I post random stuff on the internet when I'm bored.
Nobody is saying that Iron Man, Thor, and Captain America were hugely popular like Batman, but I do think people had at least heard of them in passing unlike with Guardians of the Galaxy.
To answer the question of how people knew about Iron Man, just a little Googling shows that Iron Man was featured in a cartoon in 1966 for 13 episodes - you know back when there were only like 12 channels on television and people didn't have many choices about what to watch. The first action figure appeared in 1975, and the character was one of five Avengers in a video game in 1991 that later was turned into a popular Sega Genesis game. Apparently, even Paul McCartney knew who Iron Man's villians were in the 1970's because he wrote a song about them after talking to his son about his favorite superheroes while his son played with his action figures.
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:10 am |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm Posts: 68387
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Tuukka wrote: I'm someone who actually used to regularly read FF, X-men, Spidey, etc, when I was younger. And even I didn't know who Iron Man or Thor were, before the movies were announced. I had vaguely heard of Captain America, I think he had a quick cameo in one of the X-men stories I read, but I didn't give a shit about his character based on that cameo. You're in a very, very, very small minority.
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:37 am |
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Flava'd vs The World
The Kramer
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 11:36 am Posts: 25433 Location: Classified
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Rocket Raccoon is the sell here and at the very least kids are gonna love him. At best he is a Jack Sparrow like phenomenon. The other Guardians won't even matter in the marketing.
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:52 am |
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Jmart
Superman: The Movie
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 8:47 am Posts: 21230 Location: Massachusetts
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I thought it came out earlier in the summer and not August. With that in mind I'll go with what Magnus said but on the lower end. $135 million Tuukka wrote: If everyone indeed knew Iron Man, how did they know him? The comic ever only got 200.000 in circulation. Was is the animated series that run from 1994 to 1995? The one that was poorly received both by critics and fans, got bad ratings, and was then cancelled? And was then rerun non-stop. All children shows are rerun into the ground.
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Last edited by Jmart on Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:03 am |
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Jack Sparrow
KJ's Leading Idiot
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:15 pm Posts: 36949
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
People are discussing the property they are forgetting to discuss if there is enough awareness for the movie. Disney needs to just do that with amazing teaser/trailers and create good enough interest among the families and fans. With the goodwill from Marvel there is a potential but this needs heck of a marketing campaign to be big.
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:55 am |
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Tuukka
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:35 am Posts: 1830 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Jmart wrote: And was then rerun non-stop. All children shows are rerun into the ground. nnairol wrote: To answer the question of how people knew about Iron Man, just a little Googling shows that Iron Man was featured in a cartoon in 1966 for 13 episodes - you know back when there were only like 12 channels on television and people didn't have many choices about what to watch. The first action figure appeared in 1975, and the character was one of five Avengers in a video game in 1991 that later was turned into a popular Sega Genesis game. Apparently, even Paul McCartney knew who Iron Man's villians were in the 1970's because he wrote a song about them after talking to his son about his favorite superheroes while his son played with his action figures. While it's cute Paul McCartney mentioned Iron Man in a song, I find it extremely unlikely that helped to create a major mainstream movement that pushed the film into huge B.O. You are all still talking about really niche mainstream pop culture impact, and the brand had a full 50 years to build it. When you consider that, the list of the brand's high points in popular consciousness becomes very unimpressive. You do realize, that Phantom, Dennis The Menace, Super Mario, etc, had a much larger cultural awareness than Iron Man had before the movies came out? Yet you couldn't sell movies with them. Brand value has significance only if people say "They are making movie out of IRON MAN? Man, I love Iron Man! He is awesome! Can't wait to see the film!", or alternatively "Iron Man? Yeah, I've heard he's pretty awesome. I have many friends who are die-hard fans. I have to check the movie when it comes out". And that kind of enthusiasm needs more than just a vague, passing familiarity with the character. Iron Man must have the most modest, quiet fanbase on earth. Because when the marketing for the first film was on full roll, you could hear barely anyone on internet talk about how big fans of the character they are. That includes this very board, BTW. Iron Man didn't become a major B.O hit because of pre-established brand recognition. That didn't mean anything for the film. It became a huge hit because it had a cool, distinctive premise, and the film looked awesome. Which is the whole point, in relation to the Guardians Of The Galaxy. The film actually does have a pretty cool premise, and the rest is dependent on the level of awesomeness it can sell in the marketing. A walk down the memory lane - Here is the original Iron Man predictions thread from this forum: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=21241Notice how nobody believes Iron Man to be well known among mainstream - He's compared to the likes of Daredevil, Ghost Rider and Constantine. The predictions mostly ranged between 100-150 million. Everyone agrees that the brand value wasn't gonna help the film, it needed to stand on its own feet. It was only in the last few weeks before the release, that people started feeling a potential 200+ million gross.
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 2:41 am |
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BK
Forum General
Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 8:30 am Posts: 7041
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
I like how Thor 2's struggle to $200m means this is locked to be as big as the original Thor or CA otherwise it's a disappointment. Do you people live in reality?
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Thu Jan 02, 2014 2:46 am |
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publicenemy#1
Extraordinary
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:25 am Posts: 19448 Location: San Diego
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
Alright... so the advertising/TV spots have been pretty good/appealing imo. I'm thinking an opening slightly below Thor/CA could happen.
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Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:32 pm |
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Dil
Forum General
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2009 9:48 pm Posts: 8942 Location: Houston, Texas
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
publicenemy#1 wrote: Alright... so the advertising/TV spots have been pretty good/appealing imo. I'm thinking an opening slightly below Thor/CA could happen. Agreed ^. The marketing for this has been pretty effective over the last couple of months and the trailers always get good reactions in theatres. Also, supposedly the first trailer for AOU is being shown at Comic-Con this year. If they were smart they would advertise it being attached to the end credits of this movie. I know it was meant be some big surprise back when TFA came out, but obviously no one expected TA to be as big as it was. Now even a small glimpse of TA2 would be an EVENT itself.
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Mon Jun 23, 2014 8:00 pm |
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lesterg
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 11:40 am Posts: 1339
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
A friend of a friend saw this in unfinished form and said the character stuff/humor is terrific and that the story is almost non-existent.
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Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:23 pm |
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Keyser Söze
Quality is a great business plan
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2007 9:21 pm Posts: 6787
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
If true then its reviews will be middling. Not enough for a huge breakout.
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Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:51 pm |
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lesterg
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 11:40 am Posts: 1339
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 Re: Guardians of the Galaxy: Will it really be a big hit?
We'll see, I don't know the guy or his tastes. It's also early (this was at least a few weeks back) and there's no telling how much things will change before August.
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Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:58 pm |
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