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 GOP 2024 
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Post Re: GOP 2024
A strong progressive nominee is still probably a couple election cycles away. They've made huge inroads over the last 5-10 years, with formidable candiates like Bernie and Warren and a couple others (but mostly just Bernie), and continue to grow in number in Congress, but the party and country hasn't quite gotten there yet to nominate one for President. I expect the first one to breakthrough to likely fail in the general too, unless they have Obama-like appeal.

But they're getting there. In general, the majority of Dem candidates and nominees across local, state, and national elections have been more progressive than the last for the better part of the last 20-25 years at least.

The GOP is a little different. I'd say they've also moved more progressive in general (their voters at least), but they always seem to have a large group that try (and usually succeds in some manner) to reel the platform back a decade or more to make contrasts with the Dems. I saw a segment celebrating a gay music conductor for Pride Month on Fox News the other day. That wouldn't have been on Fox News 10 years ago. But at the same time, you have members of Congress like MTG who say they don't believe in evolution in 2021... It's like a push and pull scenario for them, whereas the Dems are gradually going forward over time.

I think it may just take some time for the relics in the GOP to, well, pass on in order to get the party on a more forward thinking track that's more representative of their voters and the country. (Also doesn't help when a few wackos like MTG behave like it's 1821 still.) The old Dems have this issue to, but most of them do tend to jump on board the forward track of the party eventually.

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Sat Jun 12, 2021 11:19 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
"pass on in order to get the party on a more forward thinking track that's more representative of their voters and the country"


The "country" is not a predominantly left leaning one if that's what you mean by "representative of voters and the country." I still believe it's largely 50/50 and I believe the 2020 election results are proof. It was closer than I imagined, even with someone as divisive as Trump. Any establishment Republican going against Kamala has a good chance. Of course, I admit that might be wishful thinking on my part, though, for my part I will continue supporting and funding anti-progressive candidates in my local districts.

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Sun Jun 13, 2021 12:30 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Now my work tells us we have to watch out for some guy going from stadium to stadium hanging a giant TRUMP WON banner, not only stirring shit up but blocking the view of the fans behind him. And then when he gets kicked out he goes on twitter and complains about free speech.

Can you guys tell the rest of your cult to take a chill pill? This year already has us doing enough extra work...

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Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:04 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Shack wrote:
Cynosure wrote:
They can make up for Georgia, North-Carolina and Arizona with the rust belt, but the moment they lose Texas, which will probably happen by the mid 2030s at the latest, it's over for them anyway.


I think there would always be a competitive 2nd party if the elections continue to exist and are fair, it's just it would be an overall left wing country where the future Republicans would be as far left as the Biden and Pelosi types are now and the Democrats would be the AOC level socialists. That's if the US continues to go left, but the question is, is it guaranteed to? Left wing activists control nearly every institution in the US (media, big tech, education, etc.), however the awareness that they do is much greater than it was ten years ago which could make it harder for them to keep it.


This is an old post but anyway...

Is the US even moving left? If it is, it's really slow. Too slow. By the time someone truly leftist can be in the White House, Florida will be underwater. And that doesn't account for who is moving rightward.

As a non-American, I feel like if the US doesn't stop its slide into fascism and corporatism fast enough, the whole world is fucked even more than it is now and obviously the speed at which we're all fucked is getting faster and faster.

The media being left is a falsehood. Following Bernie Sanders in the 2016 and 2020 election cycles has convinced me that there is no left bias in the media, it's centrist bias and continuous propagating of elite bullshit. Just this past couple of weeks they were covering how great it was that Branson and Bezos are having a billionaire space race when the majority of the world is still suffering from the covid pandemic and without vaccines.

In fact, the pandemic has also convinced me that there is no hope for the human race. Climate change is much worse than the pandemic and we couldn't and still cannot work together within countries much less across them. Whoever the elite are when the system collapses, I hope there'll be enough wise people to punish them instead of letting them attempt to fly to the fucking moon or something. It won't solve the issues then, but fuck us if we should allow them to enjoy the end of days.

And circling back to the topic at hand, if Trump was allowed to run again, I think he could win. Biden really doesn't look like he can and Harris was such a shitty candidate and still is one. Hell, the Democrats are hardly putting up a fight for voting rights so it doesn't matter who runs if they can overturn results in Georgia, Arizona, Wisconsin, and elsewhere. Will anyone punish Biden, Harris, Schumer, and Pelosi (amongst others) for this pathetic attempt to defend the right to vote? No, no one will.

It's all downhill folks. The elite vs the rest of us.

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Wed Jul 21, 2021 12:50 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
You’re right that the overwhelming majority of the world is far more left than even Democrats. America is an always has been a fundamentally different country from the rest of the world.

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Wed Jul 21, 2021 12:58 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
zwackerm wrote:
You’re right that the overwhelming majority of the world is far more left than even Democrats. America is an always has been a fundamentally different country from the rest of the world.


Well, to be fair, didn't it accelerate after Reagan and the worship of corporations?

Not that that didn't happen before, but the taxes back then were comparable to Europe. Not that taxes is the only thing that makes a country more left.

The influence of rich elites is detrimental to us all and I'll never support a system that is so easily bought as a working system. You could make the argument that Americans are as free as the Chinese and the Russians. None of you realize how much propaganda that you regurgitate and are puppets of the elite.

The whole left vs right thing is a joke. Most of your politicians have no backbone and will sing for the highest bidder.

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Wed Jul 21, 2021 1:06 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
BK wrote:
The elite vs the rest of us.


This thesis is correct although I disagree with some of the reasons you got to it

We could use a legitimate left wing populist movement with views like yours that understands the establishment is acting like fascists right now with the unhealthy alliance between Democrat party/media/big tech/billionaires/etc., even if they'll never be on board with the Trump base due to farther left social views. It's not about right vs left, it's about regular people vs authoritarian elites, the Trump base hates the establishment Republicans for the same reason who continue to be the most spineless disappointments imaginable.

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Wed Jul 21, 2021 1:51 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Interestingly, the Covid vaccine hesitant group is a coalition of both liberals (Blacks, Hispanics, young people, hippies, first-generation immigrants) and anti-establishment conservatives. Universities that prohibit unvaccinated people from attending is an example of systemic racism to exclude minority groups. A lot of the rhetoric against the vaccine hesitant have been incredibly racist against Blacks and Hispanics.


Wed Jul 21, 2021 4:59 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Dems, assuming no JB: Kamala did everything needed of a VP candidate at a very high level (handful of big speeches, 1 debate, and FUNDRAISING) but as a leas candidate, I still see her as highly, highly flawed.

If JB opts out of 2024, I feel strongly that Stacey Abrams should be the nominee. She is so much warmer and more personable than Kamala & her success w/ Georgia in 2020 has elevated her to straight living legend status within the Democrats.

Repubs: Frankly, I don't know. Nikki Haley? Really difficult to call at the moment.

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Sun Jul 25, 2021 9:19 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Excel wrote:
Dems, assuming no JB: Kamala did everything needed of a VP candidate at a very high level (handful of big speeches, 1 debate, and FUNDRAISING) but as a leas candidate, I still see her as highly, highly flawed.

If JB opts out of 2024, I feel strongly that Stacey Abrams should be the nominee. She is so much warmer and more personable than Kamala & her success w/ Georgia in 2020 has elevated her to straight living legend status within the Democrats.

Repubs: Frankly, I don't know. Nikki Haley? Really difficult to call at the moment.


Trump

He is basically doing campaign speeches. If he was out he should be golfing and enjoying golden years after 5 years on the grind

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Sun Jul 25, 2021 10:23 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Trump will be abandoned if 2022 doesn't go well. Even if it does, he has lost a lot of his followers, lack of social media is crippling, this should be obvious from the "success" of "from the desk of dtj" etc

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Mon Jul 26, 2021 12:05 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
My theory on how things got to this point between Democrats and Republicans

- The US is an oligarchy built for billionaires to get wealthy, big pharma, war profiteers, etc. They completely control the media and virtually every other institution allowing them to shape the perception of candidates and can use their unlimited finance to box any outsiders out. So it's a perfect system as the final 2 candidates are always ones acceptable to the establishment no matter who wins, the media barrier alone means nobody else has a chance. See George Carlin - it's a big club and you ain't in it!

- The elitist class shifts left with the rise of internet and social media billionaires, presumably oil guys born in early 1900s die, etc. No problem, it just means the Republican party should have been a left party, and the Democrats more left. This is on track when you look at how McCain and Romney were arguably more left wing than Bill Clinton.

- However something gets fucked up. Perhaps race in 08 heightened emotions. Despite Romney and McCain's positions being not that far right of Obama, the media greatly preferred the latter and treated him like a god compared to them. By 2016 every institution including ones like the media and big tech clearly preferred the Democrats. This continued into 2016 with an expected coronation for Hillary over weak establishment GOP field. Despite after 8 years it would have been natural to be the Republicans turn, the now heavily Democrat leaning establishment had their eyes on 16 or more.

- Then the establishment make a really dumb move - just to MAKE SURE she won, not only did they leave the establishment GOP candidates for dead, but they get the media to make a star out of the unelectable joke candidate in Trump, hoping he'd be the general candidate to then get wiped off the map by Hillary. They let the fox in the henhouse themselves. And the rest is history. Following that the establishment Republicans side with Trump for their own benefit and the Democrat controlled media show their teeth for real by painting Trump as a russian spy nazi golden showers lover and essentially declaring war on conservatives.

The only way out of this "civil war" between establishment class Democrats and Republicans where they both go back to serving the oligarchs equally, would be for their media lapdogs to throw a bone to the Haley style normal Republican candidates, and possibly for one to win in 2024 to reset the party and "normal" politics. Otherwise it's a fight to the death although one of the Democrats could win by making it a one party state.

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Mon Jul 26, 2021 4:27 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
This recent Infrastructure bill passing in the Senate from both parties is a strong sign towards bi-partisan workings in the future.

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Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:21 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
I am frankly annoyed with progressives who are not pleased with this passing along bipartisan lines. The fact that our highly divided government passed this on a super majority is a huge deal right now.

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Fri Jul 30, 2021 1:22 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
If it actually passed then sure. But, usually, the Republican way is to gut bills like this, forcing Democrats to make an infinite amount of compromises, and then they just vote against it anyways.

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Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:35 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Seems like DeSantis doesn't want to run in 2024

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Wed Oct 06, 2021 4:36 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Looks pretty obvious now that Trump will be running unopposed if he does not go to jail first. It will mean the GOP will lose the White House again, but at least they’ll get the House and might even get the Senate.

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 8:32 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
I do think if Trump ran again, it would at least be closer, but definitely would not get the independent votes necessary to win.

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 8:48 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
The VA gubernatorial candidates are neck and neck. Seems odd considering how much the state has trended blue since 2016, it's barely even a swing state anymore

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:20 am
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Maybe Greg Abbott is a sleeper if DeSantis is a no, he can be a poor man's version of him in terms of the covid response

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 12:36 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
No one likes Greg Abbott lol

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 12:42 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
Trump will probably get the same support so if Democrats are worse he could win, Biden was > Hillary, but it's possible he has a Jimmy Carter like 4 years and either is an unpopular candidate before considering he's 82, or Harris runs who brings her own problems. Trump would probably shoot himself in the foot by not letting election fraud go while Democrats beat J6 dead horse to a pulp that would make Negan blush.

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 1:25 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
I think Trump could get more votes, but his opponent will artificially have their vote count inflated as well due to all the people who will vote "against Trump" that wouldn't have voted otherwise.

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:01 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024
DeSantis isn't going to give a concrete answer until early 2023 at the earliest. I don't know what he's said, but he should be ruling out a run in 2024 right now to the press (only to change his mind, of course, like any politician afterwards). He has re-election to deal with in 2022, and either committing to a presidential run or hinting at it can be damaging to that race.

Florida is always close (consistently in that 52-48 range), and when up against a long established state name like Charlie Crist (assuming he wins the Democratic nomination) is going to come down to every vote. Crist only lost to Rick Scott by 1% (or 64,000 votes) back in 2014. And DeSantis only won by 0.4% (or 23,000 votes) in 2018.

It's not going to be a race where running for the GOP nomination in 2024 can be a distraction, or be something that can be used against him.

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Fri Oct 08, 2021 5:06 pm
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Post Re: GOP 2024


I agree. Until the 2020 race is "solved", Republicans should just stay home in 2022 and 2024. Don't know if I'd say it's the "single most important thing" Republicans or anyone else can do (I can list many more important things), but good way to make it sound urgent.

Some of the supporters in the comments are in agreement as well. Effective messaging so far.

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“Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.”
"Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."
“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
“You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.”


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Thu Oct 14, 2021 10:47 am
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