Anyone have any thoughts? I think Obama made a huge mistake in not picking her. I know the Archie Gates, Beeblebrox's, Groucho's, etc. would shit their pants, but PUMA goes both ways. Too many Dems would rather lose again, than retake the White House with the vile Clintons. Palin would not have that much traction with Clinton as the VP. Would she have even been chosen? Also, I talked with many white women that would have voted for Clinton as President in the GE last week that are registered Republicans or Independents that lean Republican. They are now leaning towards McCain or planning on voting for him. For anyone thinking Biden will "destroy" Palin in the VP debates rewatch the Clarence Thomas confirmation, when he seemed more intent on damaging Anita Hill's testimony.

I still can't believe Dem. primary voters got snookered by the media into voting for the weaker candidate (IMO), yet again.

I still think the election can go either way, look for the polls that have Wed-Fri. Sept. 10-12 numbers for this week to be a true indication of where the race is at the moment. However, the Obama campaign doesn't seem to have its shit together. Amazing how difficult it is when you are no longer the one receiving the benefit of media bias.

While I did support Hillary during the primaries and I do believe that Obama had a ton of media favorability after winning Iowa. Obama did win the Democratic primary. To me it shows a glaring flaw in the way a candidate is chose. It isn't just that caucuses do not reflect an election correctly(it does represent enthusiam) it is that the democratic primaries showed that someone doesn't have to win enough states to win the general election(Hillary would of beat Obama had been the actual Election by states). We have what we have now and I have to say that even though I am dismayed by the pick of what is IMO the weaker candidate(I love Biden though and am glad that he is the VP pick, though sad if he wins he will be out of the senate) I do have to give it to Obama to having the most energized base of any candidate out there(not enough to win). I am scared that he will be very divisive and of the eventual backlash from not meeting expecations if he gets elected. All I want at this point is a democrat as a president. I think Palin will make it tougher in places like Nevada, Montona, ND, SD, appalachia including western Pennsylvania and OH, as well as Minnesota. Obama can still very well win and I do hope so because I do not want McCain for the next four years.

I wouldn't assume that if Obama had chosen Hillary then McCain still would have chosen Palin.

In any case, he couldn't choose Clinton because Bill has had all sorts of questionable financial dealings and it would all have come out.

The Republicans would have loved Obama to pick Hillary, the sheer amount of shandy deals the Clintons have racked up over the years would have buried Obama in endless amounts of crap.

Indeed it makes a good case to either choose a boring VP (Biden) or a Newbie (Palin) since it minimizes an serious skeletons in the closet for the opposition to cloud the issue with.

I do find the continuing moaning from Hillary supporters to be quite amusing however, i mean did Kenneth Clarke moan when he lost the 1997 Tory leadership contest, did Gordon Brown publically moan when Blair took over Labour in 1994? You have a contest if you lose you take it like a man (or woman) and shut up.

And far far too many Dems would rather lose just so they can say "I told you that you should have voted for Hillary."

Yeah but if you were Clinton, you'd be voting for McCain : (

Im with Loyal, if i were Clinton i wouldnt campaign that much for Obama, she now knows that if he loses that she will no doubt be the democratic candidate in 2012, infact, since i think McCain is a one term president i have no doubt that if he wins in november that it will be Palin vs Clinton in 2012.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQqIpdBOg6I

I still think Clinton would have been the best VP choice. Wouldn't have to worry about losing the female vote, and the Appalachia region would have been near locked up. And it would have brought Kentucky, Tennessee, and Arkansas into play. His chances in Colorado, Montana, and probably Virginia would have been worse, but he'll have to fight for these states, where as he wouldn't have had to fight all that much for the Clinton states, and could have focused on at least one of the states I mentioned. It would probably had made Indiana a little easier to win if he wins there. I view these states as core Democratic States.

The pick would have brought it's negatives of course too, just like Clinton had she won, chosen Obama to be her VP. I really thought either of them could have beat McCain without much trouble given the last 8 years and everything, but it's just too close to my liking. And it's hard to understand why to be honest. I don't see any reason why the DEMS shouldn't be owning this election. And if the DEMS lose, it's all their own doing. They simply don't know how to connect with the American people, and they don't know how to win if they can't win this election year which should have been 100% certain.

I read that McCain is attracting 15% of DEMS, while Obama is attracting just 9% of REPS. It needs WORK. Stop the McSame, we need change talk for a little bit.

It would have been the dream ticket. But while we can now ponder it, the questions still remain about Hillary overshadowing Obama; Obama succumbing to political pressure and how that made him look; would Hillary really take the #2 spot; etc, etc.

I love Hillary. She's got my vote if she does decide to run again. However, right now, this is not the question to be asking. The primaries are over. The VP has been picked.

Focus all the energy towards Obama/Biden.

Hillary is never going to be president, ever. But if there's a democrat president she has a chance of becoming a very important Senator and passing a bunch of laws that mean a lot to her. So it makes me laugh when people who say they are for her are pulling for the other side.

hillary eliminated herself in spring with all the shit she talked. she doesnt do that, she is more than likely the nominee, but after all the crap shit pulled, no way should get it.

as for polls, its his convention bump. chill.

If McCain is elected he will probably die in his first term. Look how Bush has aged over 8 years, as if it was 20 years. The job has a lot of stress related to it and hard work that I doubt he can keep up with. So Hillary would be facing Palin and 2012 and end up a stain on the floor even if she got the nomination which she might well not.

IMO etc.

He chose the person he thought is best for the position, not the person who could pull in more votes. Admirable, but McCain isn't playing by those rules so it could end up backfiring.

ID is correct. I think the Biden pick will hurt him... he's a fine choice for the job itself, but in terms of adding anything to the campaign or helping him get elected, he brings you nothing... he's boring.

Not playing by the rules how?

I can't wait until the VP debate. Palin is going to look so utterly misinformed and unintelligent. And if there are audience questions, look out for some funny quotes. There's going to be some material for the late night talk shows to eat up.

Peace,
Mike

I think Bush vs Gore/Kerry proved that there are far too many people voting on the basis of which candidate they like better, over which one will fit the job. I wasn't really watching the debates 8 years ago (I was 10), but from I've heard, Gore killed him, didn't he? But Bush has the likeable schlub thing going. Palin has been a rock star in the press since she got announced, I'm sure she'll attract the fancy of many at the debates too.

Do you really think Palin's the person McCain thought was best for the position?

Last time I checked that wasn't a rule for being VP.

THAT'S a presumptive thing to say. McCain has run for president about 27 times now. And he might win this time. So it's never too late.

27=2

It's like the Ireland equation

We also shouldn't forget Obama's only like 49, 2012 isn't his only option. He could wait until 2020 before running again, and still be a decade younger than McCain is now. Shit McCain's old.

He said "those rules", as in the "pick the person you think is best for the job" rules that he said Obama was playing by. The word "those" means it doesnt have to be an actual rule.

No, I'm saying it's presumptive to say it's now or never.