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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Beeblebrox wrote: It seems like the notion that the polls will tighten up as the race goes on doesn't seem to be happening. It's still a long way to the election of course, but I'd expect the current trend to continue for some time. By the time they do start moving the other way toward McCain, there will be too much ground for him to cover to win. The interesting thing is that overall, they are close and within the margin of error. I almost wish Obama could win the elctoral college and lose the popular vote; and then maybe we'd have a good movement to get rid of it, since it would have made two elections in a short period of time where the will of the people was not followed.
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Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:01 pm |
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Beeblebrox
All Star Poster
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 9:40 pm Posts: 4679
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Groucho wrote: The interesting thing is that overall, they are close and within the margin of error. That's the national polls. I pay much more attention to the state polling for obvious reasons. I think the electoral picture is shaping up to be a lot less close (I won't use the L-word just yet) than what anyone would have thought just six months ago.
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Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:29 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Since last update: All moves are towards Obama: Iowa moves from weak Dem to strong Dem South Dakota moves from strong GOP to barely GOP Minnesota moves from weak Dem to strong Dem 
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Tue Jul 15, 2008 10:51 am |
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Chris
life begins now
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:09 pm Posts: 6480 Location: Columbus, Ohio
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 Re: Electoral college watch
What's next? Idaho, Arizona, and Kansas becoming competitive?!
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Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:26 pm |
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Tyler
Powered By Hate
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:55 pm Posts: 7578 Location: Torrington, CT
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Idaho won't be competitive. The only place he'll win there is Moscow. SD isn't shocking, though.
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Tue Jul 15, 2008 10:17 pm |
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Chris
life begins now
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:09 pm Posts: 6480 Location: Columbus, Ohio
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 Re: Electoral college watch
SC is down to 6.
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Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:11 pm |
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xiayun
Extraordinary
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:41 pm Posts: 25109 Location: San Mateo, CA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Groucho wrote: The interesting thing is that overall, they are close and within the margin of error.
But when a batch of polls all show one candidate ahead, even if most of them are within the margin of error, the likelihood of him behind becomes smaller very quickly (the same assertion the Electoral-vote article made today, although his math is a little off there). NC is getting closer too.
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Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:15 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
xiayun wrote: Groucho wrote: The interesting thing is that overall, they are close and within the margin of error.
But when a batch of polls all show one candidate ahead, even if most of them are within the margin of error, the likelihood of him behind becomes smaller very quickly (the same assertion the Electoral-vote article made today, although his math is a little off there). NC is getting closer too. Actually with today's map, North Carolina moved from barely GOP to weak GOP. 
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Wed Jul 16, 2008 3:02 pm |
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xiayun
Extraordinary
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:41 pm Posts: 25109 Location: San Mateo, CA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Groucho wrote: xiayun wrote: NC is getting closer too. Actually with today's map, North Carolina moved from barely GOP to weak GOP. I was actually comparing the latest poll to the previous one from the same polling source (SurveyUSA). The signal is more relevant that way since different sources have different methods.
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Wed Jul 16, 2008 3:32 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
xiayun wrote: Groucho wrote: xiayun wrote: NC is getting closer too. Actually with today's map, North Carolina moved from barely GOP to weak GOP. I was actually comparing the latest poll to the previous one from the same polling source (SurveyUSA). The signal is more relevant that way since different sources have different methods. Ah, true. Electoral College just uses whatever the most recent poll is.
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Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:49 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
And with today's map (7/18), North Carolina moves back from weak GOP to barely GOP. Also, Nevada moves from weak GOP to weak DEM, putting another state in Obama's column Oregon moves from barely DEM to weak DEM. ... once more, all moves toward Obama. 
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:28 am |
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Jedi Master Carr
Extraordinary
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 9:51 pm Posts: 11637
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 Re: Electoral college watch
I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily.
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:54 am |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Jedi Master Carr wrote: I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily. I often wondered that myself.
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:57 am |
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Timayd
The 5th B-Sharp
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2006 8:48 am Posts: 1506
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Groucho wrote: Jedi Master Carr wrote: I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily. I often wondered that myself. Pollster's average has 10.1 points ahead http://www.pollster.com/08-OR-Pres-GE-MvO.php
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:20 am |
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Chris
life begins now
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:09 pm Posts: 6480 Location: Columbus, Ohio
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Timayd wrote: Groucho wrote: Jedi Master Carr wrote: I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily. I often wondered that myself. Pollster's average has 10.1 points ahead http://www.pollster.com/08-OR-Pres-GE-MvO.php It will most likely fall in line with Washington/California as being a "strong" Obama win.
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:22 pm |
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redspear
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:08 am Posts: 1879
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Groucho wrote: Jedi Master Carr wrote: I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily. I often wondered that myself. It doesn't really take a genius to figure that out. Many of these polls have a large number of undecideds it kind of throws off the accuracy of the polls if you just look at McCains and Obamas numbers. Oregon for example is 46% Obama 37% McCain leaving 17% for another candidate or undecided. Indiana on the other hand is 48% Obama and 47% McCain only leaving 5% in play. Come the election you really should expect to see Oregon goto Obama 58% to 42%
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:34 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
redspear wrote: Groucho wrote: Jedi Master Carr wrote: I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily. I often wondered that myself. It doesn't really take a genius to figure that out. Many of these polls have a large number of undecideds it kind of throws off the accuracy of the polls if you just look at McCains and Obamas numbers. So why doesn't that same effect show up in other heaviuly blue states, then? If your theory were correct, we'd expect to see the same thing in Washington or Massachusetts or New York, but we don't.
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:38 pm |
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redspear
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:08 am Posts: 1879
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Groucho wrote: redspear wrote: Groucho wrote: Jedi Master Carr wrote: I didn't get why Oregon would ever be barely Dem. I would think Obama would win that mostly liberal state easily. I often wondered that myself. It doesn't really take a genius to figure that out. Many of these polls have a large number of undecideds it kind of throws off the accuracy of the polls if you just look at McCains and Obamas numbers. So why doesn't that same effect show up in other heaviuly blue states, then? If your theory were correct, we'd expect to see the same thing in Washington or Massachusetts or New York, but we don't. Both NY and Washington have fewer undecideds as well as Massachusetts. It could be that Oregon voters aren't as excited over Obama outside of the core base of democrats in Oregon but at the same time neither is the republican base except for though those who only vote dem or rep are saying they will vote for Obama or McCain. Oregon has a fairly conservative eastern side of the state. Essentially the larger the undedicated portion of the poll the less the poll will reflect election results.
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:59 pm |
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Jedi Master Carr
Extraordinary
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 9:51 pm Posts: 11637
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Ok that makes sense. I think Obama should win Oregon pretty easily at least as well as Gore and Kerry won it.
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Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:15 pm |
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zennier
htm
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 2:38 pm Posts: 10316 Location: berkeley
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Yeah, Oregon population dynamics are interesting. The urban West is highly liberal, but the much more rural East/Central are is quite conservative. It's a West Coast conservatism, though - much less of a social conservatism that you'd see in the Sunbelt.
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Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:56 am |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
On July 19th, two moves away from Obama toward McCain: Alaska moves from barely GOP to strong GOP. Virginia moves from barely DEM to tied. 
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Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:16 pm |
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Mannyisthebest
Forum General
Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 3:53 pm Posts: 8642 Location: Toronto, Canada
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 Re: Electoral college watch
He needs Virgina to win imo...
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Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:55 am |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Mannyisthebest wrote: He needs Virgina to win imo... He doesn't NEED it to win (if he wins all the blue states in the above map, he's got it easily), but if he gets Virginia, he's pretty much guaranteed a win.
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Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:19 am |
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Mannyisthebest
Forum General
Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 3:53 pm Posts: 8642 Location: Toronto, Canada
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 Re: Electoral college watch
The polls will close up and the "white people say they will vote for a black guy" effect will kick in...
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Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:33 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm Posts: 12096 Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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 Re: Electoral college watch
Mannyisthebest wrote: The polls will close up and the "white people say they will vote for a black guy" effect will kick in... It won't be that big of an effect. With a few exceptions, the polls were fairly accurate during the primaries.
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Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:51 pm |
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