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 Wonder Woman 1984 

Rate this film:
A 33%  33%  [ 5 ]
B 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
C 47%  47%  [ 7 ]
D 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
F 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 15

 Wonder Woman 1984 
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
It's logically flawed, like any DCEU movie (with the exception of Wonder Woman 1)

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Sat Dec 26, 2020 11:04 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Man of Steel - A-

Shazam! - B-
Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Ultimate Edition - B-

Wonder Woman 1984 - C
Aquaman - C-

Suicide Squad - D+
Wonder Woman - D
Justice League - F


Sat Dec 26, 2020 11:10 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Maybe there's a reason Patti Jenkins didn't direct anything for 10 years after Monster.

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Sun Dec 27, 2020 3:13 am
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Am I the only one who thought Pedro Pascal was badly miscast in this movie and felt completely out of place?


Sun Dec 27, 2020 12:52 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
yeah this film sucks though I liked Pedro Pascal.

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Sun Dec 27, 2020 2:33 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
I too liked Pedro Pascal.
I think it’s telling that Chris Pine dominated the scenes he was in with Gal Gadot. Great actress but when not in her superhero form she is a lightweight. This is disappointing because I loved the first WW.

Ranking:

Wonder Woman
Shazam!
Aquaman
Man of Steel
Suicide Squad
Batman v Superman
Justice League
Wonder Woman 1984

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Sun Dec 27, 2020 2:54 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Aside from just a general better plot, the film needed more scenes when him and Diana are comedically trying to figure out what to do with the jet on the runway.

Also, the film just shows why the No Man's Land scene is so great because doing a great action sequence in these films is hard. The action here is not bad but its just so boring. Nothing invoked a sense of wonder.

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Sun Dec 27, 2020 2:59 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Really shocked at the reaction. It is no worse than a standard Marvel flick.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 3:22 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
zwackerm wrote:
Really shocked at the reaction. It is no worse than a standard Marvel flick.


That's incorrect. The standard Marvel films do not try to take themselves seriously anymore. WW84 could easily be compared to Thor 2 which is low tier Marvel movie and script and execution wise the later is better.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:04 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
I had more fun with this than a lot of Marvel films, to be honest.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:05 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Yes at the end is about your own choice but the execution and story this time around are definitely standard DC than Marvel. Marvel movies focus on lesser things and build up the plot (if not villains) properly before moving on to final battle that ends with excitement and thrilling action set pieces rather than pushing agenda or message.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:13 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Marvel nailing its effort to be merely "good" always scores more points that DC averagely executing something much more ambitious. :whistle:

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Sun Dec 27, 2020 8:57 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Not really true as well. DC fans don't understand the fact that ambition doesn't always translate to a coherent movie experience. There is really no need to take these movies too seriously, yes it worked for Nolan but that does not mean every DC movie will work like that. I also feel WB's intervention is a little too heavy in making these movies that hampers the overall experience and their "grand" plan is not working as of now, maybe COVID-19 break might help them in the long run.

Most DC movies feel overstuffed with ideas instead of trying to be cleanly executing one-or-two concepts that can make general audience happy. Fans will definitely buy these but casual audience would not catch them and will forget the overall movie experience after one watch. There is also no (for the lack of better word) "wonder" in DC movies that the audience would bring home with them. Audience love Iron Man's quirky/witty talks, Hulk's smash, Captain America's overly righteous tone, Black Widow's sexy fight, Thor's hammer and so on for Marvel characters. For DC other than Batman being a broody crime-fighting millionaire with personal problems every other superhero feels like they are doing this "because" they have powers instead of developing them into characters/traits that audience can take home, I am sure DC fans can point out more but I am talking about general audience and personal preference as well (while I know the origins of pretty much all superheroes I wouldn't call myself an avid comic book reader).

Another biggest issue is that you cannot have gods going at each other in EVERY movie just landing punches that have no effect on either side, its great visually (for a second) but adds nothing to the story or the action scenes. Finally which I believe has been slightly improved recently is the actual "heroics" and allowing those moments to breath like the No Man's Land scene from WW. Most DC movies have issues between gods and their own proceedings which "feel" have no concern with things that general public would care about or evoke an emotion.

Before you type to defend DC movies by giving examples of this or that just know that I am not saying that all movies have this same set of problems its just none of them have addressed most of these as of now. The first WW does a a good job handling these issues but WW84 feels like going back to DC routes instead of building on the original.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 9:42 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
There’s literally nothing incoherent about this movie. It made perfect sense to me.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:35 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
zwackerm wrote:
There’s literally nothing incoherent about this movie. It made perfect sense to me.


There are few scenes here just for the sake of injecting an idea or two but I wouldn't call WW84 incoherent as well.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:42 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Like I can understand not loving it but the hate it’s getting is very confusing. My dad and I had a GREAT time watching it. He doesn’t like superhero movies, and he thought it was very creative, different and entertaining compared to your average marvel or Batman flicks


Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:45 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
lilmac wrote:
I too liked Pedro Pascal.
I think it’s telling that Chris Pine dominated the scenes he was in with Gal Gadot. Great actress but when not in her superhero form she is a lightweight. This is disappointing because I loved the first WW.


Pine shines better in this series even when Gadot has her costume(s) on. Without him the No Man's Land would not have been effective and who can forget the emotional heft of his sacrifice in the first. In WW84 he easily outshines her even with her costume both in Cairo and Washington scenes but again his sacrifice brings a new level of acceptance for the superhero and her new power. I wish the character does not have to die but if they bring him back again it will all become meaningless.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:47 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
zwackerm wrote:
Like I can understand not loving it but the hate it’s getting is very confusing. My dad and I had a GREAT time watching it. He doesn’t like superhero movies, and he thought it was very creative, different and entertaining compared to your average marvel or Batman flicks


You gave the clue yourself that your dad does not watch/like superhero movies maybe he was in the mood for one given the time since last good or superhero action movie ;)

There are parts in this movie that I am sure people will hate and probably those are the ones that stuck with them more, that's the whole reason for watching and discussing movies on this forum.


Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:50 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
i mean the problem when comparing this to MCU is that most of the MCU are basically action-comedies and this film is a action-drama.

People ignore a lot of obvious flaws and issues with MCU because they're funny. Ant Man 2 is perhaps the best example of this where the film has an incredibly dumb plot, a lame "villain", and very meh action sequences/VFX. But the film throws in enough gags and comedic moments (particularly due to Michael Pena) that you just go along with it. Almost no one thinks Ant Man 2 is a great film but no one actively hates it either because it was passable.

WW84 tries to be an action-drama and it just falls flat in both genres, though admittedly the action sequences may have played a lot better on the big screen so I won't be too harsh on it for that. But the dramatic aspects are just not good. Whereas in the first WW, it combined great action with great drama (and a little bit of war and adventure too). That's why it is so memorable and well-liked.

The other successful DC films also managed to do better in their attempts. Aquaman succeeded because it was an action-adventure film and never really pretended to be a drama. The entire film becomes just one long journey/ride where our characters are going to different milestones to reach some mythical endpoint and it works. Shazam is a combo of an action film and a family-comedy and while I don't think the action was that great, the family-comedy works really well.

MCU goes for the safe route of just being comedies so the bar for it to pass is lower than films trying to be action-dramas. But they undeniably pass that bar and so people like them more.

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Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:59 am
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
MCU also set the bar. And let's be honest, the best DCU films have only hovered to the lower end of MCU or "Well at least it was better than that other DCU film"

MCU has built a brand of great films that one can overlook the lower B/B+ filler films that lead to the larger better stories that drive the series. DCU has none of that anymore, because they napalmed what they were planning. WW2 can be compared to Iron Man 2, but when you don't have Avenger's or other meaningful films coming up, it would have been an equally souring experience, if that was all you were going to get.

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Mon Dec 28, 2020 4:20 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
I watched this again, feel the same way. Not great, not horrid. I actually thought it was directed pretty well but the plot is just underwhelming. I liked Wiig but there's no payoff with Barbara/Cheetah. And I thought Pascal was good but the end scene with his son didn't really land with me.

The last scene with Diana/Steve is easily the best scene in the movie.


Tue Dec 29, 2020 2:14 am
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
publicenemy#1 wrote:
And I thought Pascal was good but the end scene with his son didn't really land with me.


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Tue Dec 29, 2020 2:24 am
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
One thing that could have fixed a lot of issues is setting it during the Roaring Twenties instead of the 80s. This way they could have brought back the supporting cast from the first movie and it would mean Diana wasn’t hung up on some guy (that she knew for like a week) for seventy fucking years. The 80s setting seems like it was more for the marketing than the actual story. Patty could have still thrown in her anti-socialist themes too.


Wed Dec 30, 2020 12:04 am
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
Magnus wrote:
i mean the problem when comparing this to MCU is that most of the MCU are basically action-comedies and this film is a action-drama.

People ignore a lot of obvious flaws and issues with MCU because they're funny. Ant Man 2 is perhaps the best example of this where the film has an incredibly dumb plot, a lame "villain", and very meh action sequences/VFX. But the film throws in enough gags and comedic moments (particularly due to Michael Pena) that you just go along with it. Almost no one thinks Ant Man 2 is a great film but no one actively hates it either because it was passable.

WW84 tries to be an action-drama and it just falls flat in both genres, though admittedly the action sequences may have played a lot better on the big screen so I won't be too harsh on it for that. But the dramatic aspects are just not good. Whereas in the first WW, it combined great action with great drama (and a little bit of war and adventure too). That's why it is so memorable and well-liked.

The other successful DC films also managed to do better in their attempts. Aquaman succeeded because it was an action-adventure film and never really pretended to be a drama. The entire film becomes just one long journey/ride where our characters are going to different milestones to reach some mythical endpoint and it works. Shazam is a combo of an action film and a family-comedy and while I don't think the action was that great, the family-comedy works really well.

MCU goes for the safe route of just being comedies so the bar for it to pass is lower than films trying to be action-dramas. But they undeniably pass that bar and so people like them more.


Thegun wrote:
MCU also set the bar. And let's be honest, the best DCU films have only hovered to the lower end of MCU or "Well at least it was better than that other DCU film"

MCU has built a brand of great films that one can overlook the lower B/B+ filler films that lead to the larger better stories that drive the series. DCU has none of that anymore, because they napalmed what they were planning. WW2 can be compared to Iron Man 2, but when you don't have Avenger's or other meaningful films coming up, it would have been an equally souring experience, if that was all you were going to get.


Marvel gets their movies are for entertainment above all & people care more characters than plot. Get those 2 things right and people will easily overlook even the biggest of plot holes, such as that HYDRA controlled SHEILD the whole time...even when SHIELD formed the Avengers to stop Hydra in the first place :| :funny:

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Wed Dec 30, 2020 12:19 pm
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Post Re: Wonder Woman 1984
How do you figure? Fury formed the Avengers in the first movie to fight Loki. The rest of SHIELD/Hydra were cool with using the tesseract to build nukes and bomb all their problems away. None of the Avengers even knew Hydra was still around until Winter Soldier.

Even Thor: The Dark World, which is generally looked upon as the worst, at least takes a few scenes to set up why Natalie Portman might just happen to find the Aether in London. She’s motivated by getting some D from Thor, and who could blame her? The Dreamstone just shows up with no explanation or no set-up. This isn’t an issue of drama v comedy or settling for good v aiming for greatness. This is an issue of a half-baked script causing people to check out of the movie before the big action scenes (which would normally make people forget about the CinemaSins) even happen. There are no emotional stakes in the final fight between Diana and Cheetah so even if it lasted for more than three minutes the audience would still be bored. And constantly (CONSTANTLY) putting adorable children in danger does not make up for this.


Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:03 pm
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